Randomize ore options.

[GrayLeader]

So this is a thing that a lot of us have talked about that could be a great idea if possible and a very good solution to the ore issues.

We had an idea for the layout of ore that could benefit the game and everyone who plays and the markets as well.

Idea as follows.

On all tyles in the game have your normal distribution of ore layout in T1 ores.

On all tyles add a 3-6 month randomizer for anything above T1 ores so T2 - T5. (so every like 6 months switch it up.)

Make it to where we have a random grouping of the planets possible ores of above T1.

Benefits as follows.

1st. this would help the obtaining of ore and pricing as would add more competition in the process.

2nd. ending permanent monopolies in the safe zones.

3rd. Raise player interactions and create new ways to cause economic flow.

[biggingerman]

Love that idea makes sure all players have a chance to get rare resources

[StriderU]

I agree. Makes sure all players have a chance to get rare resources.

[Talocan]

I made a similar suggestion. I think that it should be based on usage rather than the will of the RNG gods, but I would support either.

 

[RugesV]

And to post what I posted over there:

 

To sum in up without having to read further. Random ore pools are not needed. 

 

 

 

Dynamic ore pools would just suck.  Managing mining units as it is, is already time consuming. But if you had to constantly scan,  take down old mining units, rebuild at new locations, get calibration up on those new miners,   Move your space elevator, move your space stations.  Create new bookmarks, distribute bookmarks to all your haulers.  Rinse Repeat every week. No thank you.  This would have the effect on miners, as it did to industrialist when schematics came out.  And  while a planet can be scanned down in hours, its not effortless.  Its actually allot of work. and if you had to constantly do that...... same with setting up a mining platform. 

 

Once all the planets come in. and more planets come in.  there will be plenty of ore for all who want it, and dynamic ore pools will not be needed. 

 

And then you also have to consider territory warfare. Whatever that is going to end up being, and where that is even going to be possible. 

 

[Maxim Kammerer]

6 hours ago, RugesV said:

Rinse Repeat every week.

 

You shouldn't reply without reading. Ther OP is talking about a 3-6 month cycle.

[Atmosph3rik]

6 hours ago, Maxim Kammerer said:

 

You shouldn't reply without reading. Ther OP is talking about a 3-6 month cycle.

 

I read the whole post.  But maybe i'm misunderstanding something.

 

Are you saying that because it would be a 3-6 month cycle, people could just leave all of their infrastructure in place in the hopes that a territory might have a payout that is worth mining again at some point in the next few years?

 

If it's randomized, i don't think that would work.  You could sit on a tile for years and never win the random lottery.

 

A large portion of the territories don't have an ore pool that is worth mining.

 

Unless i'm misunderstanding, this would require everyone to rescan the planets every 3-6 months to rediscover the territories with valuable ore on them.

 

NQ is already planning to add more planets with new ore.  Depending on how much demand there is, they can add as many of these as they want.

 

They could add a new planet every 3-6 months if the games growth demanded it.

 

 

[Atmosph3rik]

18 hours ago, biggingerman said:

Love that idea makes sure all players have a chance to get rare resources

 

18 hours ago, StriderU said:

I agree. Makes sure all players have a chance to get rare resources.

 

 

I hope these aren't the OPs ALTS.

 

The identical wording and the timing of their responses, in the same exact order, after each of your posts is a bit odd.

[Maxim Kammerer]

20 minutes ago, Atmosph3rik said:

Are you saying that because it would be a 3-6 month cycle, people could just leave all of their infrastructure in place in the hopes that a territory might have a payout that is worth mining again at some point in the next few years?

 

No, they leave there mining infrastructure for the 3-6 month period until the ore is deplated and than move to a fresh spot for the next 3-6 months.

 

20 minutes ago, Atmosph3rik said:

Unless i'm misunderstanding, this would require everyone to rescan the planets every 3-6 months to rediscover the territories with valuable ore on them.

 

Yes, you got it. Exploration is part of the mining business. Those, who are currently sitting on T2+ tiles might not like the idea, but it would be an improvement for evereybody else - and the game is intended for all players and not just for some lucky few, isnt' it?.

[kulkija]

32 minutes ago, Maxim Kammerer said:

 

Yes, you got it. Exploration is part of the mining business. Those, who are currently sitting on T2+ tiles might not like the idea, but it would be an improvement for evereybody else - and the game is intended for all players and not just for some lucky few, isnt' it?.

 

Scanning same tiles all over again and again and again... No thanks

 

Game is available for everybody, rare ore is not. How rare can be available for all?

[Atmosph3rik]

3 minutes ago, Maxim Kammerer said:

Yes, you got it. Exploration is part of the mining business. Those, who are currently sitting on T2+ tiles might not like the idea, but it would be an improvement for evereybody else - and the game is intended for all players and not just for some lucky few, isnt' it?.

 

 

I think it's a misconception that it's only for a lucky few.  When the reality is that it just takes a lot of determination and some planning.  Maybe a bit of teamwork.

 

There are still so many territories out there that are worth mining.  But everyone wants one of the highest value 7 tile flowers.

 

Most of the territories that i mine are just one or two tiles that are adjacent to a flower.  At least one of them i found just by looking at the map until i found some territories with Limestone in the name, and then scanning around them.  You can still easily make millions a week off of a few lower value tiles.  

 

I see complaints about people sitting on territories, but i think a lot of those territories are probably for sale too.  Just because they've already been claimed, doesn't mean they are out of play.  It might be good if NQ helped facilitate those sales happening in game, so people would feel more confident getting into it.  But the DU Auction House on discord has also built up a pretty solid reputation.

 

And NQ is planning to add more planets.  There will be more land rushes.  And if someone wants to put in the work, there will be more opportunities to claim the highest value territories.

[Maxim Kammerer]

1 hour ago, kulkija said:

Game is available for everybody, rare ore is not. How rare can be available for all?

 

You have a misconception about rarity. It means that there is not much of if. It does not mean that a minority must sit on it forever.

[Atmosph3rik]

20 minutes ago, Maxim Kammerer said:

 

You have a misconception about rarity. It means that there is not much of if. It does not mean that a minority must sit on it forever.

 

 

I think you're confusing the rarity of winning 1st place in a land race.  With the rarity of winning anything at all.

 

Just because you can't win 1st place, doesn't mean there isn't still a prize for 2nd, 3rd, 4th place etc.

 

Those 2nd and 3rd place territories are still out there.  And NQ has promised more races in the future.

 

If you decide not to join the race because you don't think you have a chance at 1st place anymore, that's on you.

 

 

[le_souriceau]

41 minutes ago, Maxim Kammerer said:

 

You have a misconception about rarity. It means that there is not much of if. It does not mean that a minority must sit on it forever.

 

Its more bad joke of disign, this "scarcity" happening with just several hundred people playing pretty much (with 2-3 dozens no-lifers among them). It means game not disigned even for thousands in terms of balance with current world generation.

 

[RugesV]

11 hours ago, Maxim Kammerer said:

 

You shouldn't reply without reading. Ther OP is talking about a 3-6 month cycle.

1 week cycle, 3 month cycle, 6 month cycle, 1 year cycle. Its all the same. Has the same issues. But at the end of the day more planets are coming. Thus more ore fields will be out there for more people to get.  Of course the OP also wants to increase HQ tile limit.  Which will limit the availability of ore for people (people will set on them, not to use, but to deny others). 

 

You swap to a 3-6 month cycle. I will tell you how it will go. Everyone that setup there nice little bases on there ore fields. Well those will no longer be ore fields. So the little guy gets hurts here. A casual player needs to be on during a specific period of time (when the ore fields renew). And if they miss that window G'luck getting ore that cycle.  Large groups of people will scan down planets promptly. Not only claiming the ore that they want to use, but also sticking HQ's down on tiles, not to use but to block others. 

 

More players will be driven from the game because the endless hollow loop of scanning. 

 

Basically the only people that will benefit from dynamic ore pools is Nomads who dont mind moving operations every 3-6 months. and Large groups that can gobble up the new flowers, possibly even blocking others.  A couple in between will break even, Maybe even a couple getting ahead, But just as many will be at a loss.  Its just not a good solution. 

 

but again its all moot because more planets will be added in and everyone will get what they want. But even the reality in that is, when that happens there will be more ore coming into the game than is needed. Heck even with the current ore pools, there might be to much ore coming into the game. And personally I feel thats why NQ is not adding in the new planets yet. Not because they are focusing on other development projects, but the game just does not need more ore coming into the game. But changing to dynamic will hurt more people then help. 

[Leniver]

Setting up a properly a ore farm takes time. 
It will just push more people to deploy "non-voxel" mining farm that just populate planet as junk station. Taking care of mining farm takes already enough time, if you have to go and search every x time for new farm I think it will just push more people out of the game.

I vote against that.


I will add an other argument against that change:
Some people have build their base on a flower specially because it was a good spot. I know that we can move ore but why forcing people to pay additional tiles because their factory, showroom stay on those "old" tile.

Edited February 13, 2023 by Leniver

[Maxim Kammerer]

20 hours ago, Atmosph3rik said:

If you decide not to join the race because you don't think you have a chance at 1st place anymore, that's on you.

 

I do not need to join the race anymore because I already seized my chance at 1st place.

[Maxim Kammerer]

18 hours ago, RugesV said:

1 week cycle, 3 month cycle, 6 month cycle, 1 year cycle. Its all the same.

 

No, it's not. For example 1 year is around 52 weeks. 1 week and 52 weeks are not the same. Simple math.

 

And no, it's also not the same in terms of gameplay. For a single player it takes several days to find a good new spot. It makes a huge difference if you need to do that every week or every 3 months or every 6 months or every year.

 

18 hours ago, RugesV said:

A casual player needs to be on during a specific period of time (when the ore fields renew).

 

That sounds like you are expecting all spots to renew at the same time. That would indeed be stupid design. But the change to asteroid respawn shows that NQ already learned that lesson.

 

18 hours ago, RugesV said:

More players will be driven from the game because the endless hollow loop of scanning. 

 

More players will join because they get a chance to actually find something valuable.

 

18 hours ago, RugesV said:

Basically the only people that will benefit from dynamic ore pools is Nomads who dont mind moving operations every 3-6 months.

 

Moving mining operations every 3-6 months doesn't make you a nomad. You can still have a permanent HQ. That's what HQ tiles are intended for.

 

18 hours ago, RugesV said:

Heck even with the current ore pools, there might be to much ore coming into the game.

 

It is not too much ore but too few players. And blocking the good spots in safe zone is not the best strategy to attract new players. With ore deplation and renewal it would even be easy to scale the amount of ore with the number of players.

[MrTenneal]

I'll drop my 2 cents in.  All these inactive tiles should not be allowed.    If they are tax delinquent for X amount of time, then you should be able to take them over by paying off the back taxes... There are 2 tiles right next to me that have a high lvl of T2 ore, over 100 in each, and they have been inactive almost since launch.  I've checked 2 different discords to see if they are a viable for sale, and even have attempted to DM the person in game.  

[GraXXoR]

On 2/13/2023 at 2:35 AM, Atmosph3rik said:

 

 

 

I hope these aren't the OPs ALTS.

 

The identical wording and the timing of their responses, in the same exact order, after each of your posts is a bit odd.

StriderU joined DU forums the same exact minute the previous post was posted. 
LOL, what are the chances, eh?

 

Strider has 3 posts, biggingerman has 4 posts. 

[le_souriceau]

On 2/14/2023 at 12:44 AM, Maxim Kammerer said:

It is not too much ore but too few players. And blocking the good spots in safe zone is not the best strategy to attract new players. With ore deplation and renewal it would even be easy to scale the amount of ore with the number of players.

 

Well its same story as with wipe (even with same people involved in talks).

 

Usually its "old guard" people who have time and experience in game, who grabbed/grinded stuff and now sit on it, inventing 100 reasons why its never can be touched and all noobs absolutly dreaming to be in forever disadvantage and its good for them actually. Is kinda both obvious and understandable position (but nothing to do with game balance, just egoistic interest).

 

Remember this argument, that on release noobs will love to start in "developed" world? Not fresh clean wiped one? This why old timers with trillions totally cannot be wiped. Hahahah.

 

But these people eaten wipe, I guess eat next tasty thing from NQ too, when time comes.

 

[Endstar]

Seems like if we ever get tile warfare a static high value tile location would be best so there is something to fight over. 

[Atmosph3rik]

9 hours ago, le_souriceau said:

Well its same story as with wipe (even with same people involved in talks).

 

Usually its "old guard" people who have time and experience in game, who grabbed/grinded stuff and now sit on it, inventing 100 reasons why its never can be touched and all noobs absolutly dreaming to be in forever disadvantage and its good for them actually. Is kinda both obvious and understandable position (but nothing to do with game balance, just egoistic interest).

 

Remember this argument, that on release noobs will love to start in "developed" world? Not fresh clean wiped one? This why old timers with trillions totally cannot be wiped. Hahahah.

 

But these people eaten wipe, I guess eat next tasty thing from NQ too, when time comes.

 

 

It's a bit of an odd coincidence that after two full wipes you would still end up on the same side of this discussion.   Given that you've been here the entire time.  It kind of seems like you're choosing not to try at all.  And instead, just sit here on the forums and whine for NQ to take other people's stuff away and give it to you.

 

It's kind of hard to imagine that you wouldn't just end up back here again crying for a handout from NQ, instead of playing the game.

 

Why would NQ fall for that again?

 

[le_souriceau]

3 hours ago, Atmosph3rik said:

Why would NQ fall for that again?

 

I value your attempt to counter-attack, so to say, but, as brits say, you kinda missed the plot here.

 

Even in best of times I was mostly social, then anything else player, never grinded much or bothered with hoarding something. So, whole this usual deflectve-revealing narrative of "aha! you envious because of our stuff, lazy communist bastard!" being old since wipe talks. Its not my motivation at all. Keep it.

My train of thought usually steams around fact, that people defend unsustainable things produced by NQ (bad for game long run), because it gives them bit of coping that their little isolated "success" (whatever it is, but usually something in game riches or comfortable state of affairs) is secure. Or even idea, that game on course of stable surivval. But I find it delusional in terms, that as long game in bad trajectory, nothing is trully safe even mid term.

 

Believe me, I'll gladly be poorest person in WORKING DU as it was more or less intended initially. With pillars and lot of players, other cool stuff. But its not the case, obviously, with current state of game. NQ pretty much can do anything in half of year/ year from now because of all problems. With adequatly sad face and "not taken lightly" ritualistic phrasing.

[Atmosph3rik]

12 minutes ago, le_souriceau said:

Even in best of times I was mostly social, then anything else player, never grinded much or bothered with hoarding something. So, whole this usual deflectve-revealing narrative of "aha! you envious because of our stuff, lazy communist bastard!" being old since wipe talks. Its not my motivation at all. Keep it.

My train of thought usually steams around fact, that people defend unsustainable things produced by NQ (bad for game long run)

 

 

How can you possibly know if something is unsustainable if you aren't even attempting to participate in it at all?

 

You're claiming something is inaccessible to you, while at the same time admitting you haven't even tried to get it.

 

There are three of you here on the forums that seem to share this opinion that there aren't any territories available for you to mine.  Five people if we count the OP's two obvious alts that they felt the need to use to support their view, to make it appear that there are more of you.

 

There are plenty of territories available for the three of you to mine in the game right now if you wanted to mine them.  And NQ is already planning to add more.

 

You keep bringing up the wipe, talking about how people were against it, and how there were all these new players who would enjoy the game if it wasn't for these big bad meanies that are stopping them by hoarding all the resources.

 

Yet here we are after the wipe.  And all you want to talk about is how bad the game is doing.

 

So which is it? did the wipe solve all the games problems or not?  Because honestly it doesn't seem like anything would make you happy.

 

I was happy with the game and playing it every day before the wipe.  (well, before they started teasing the idea of the wipe).  And i am still playing the game now, and enjoying it, after the wipe.

 

I think the game needs more, not less.

 

I don't see any reason to remove parts of the game that are already providing gameplay and content for people who are already enjoying the game.  Especially when there is plenty of room for the game to grow, if there's demand for it.