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THE FUTURE OF DUAL UNIVERSE - Discussion thread


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28 minutes ago, Aaron Cain said:

They Did give timelines on the missing planets and those are already overdue

Aye, that's pretty much the same as "no timeline", since the one given is obviously invalidated and the haven't even mentioned it in the 1.1/1.2 release prospectuses.

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nUa8pCu.png
 

the future of DU? NQ are going to have to pull their thumbs out, and sharpish, or there will be no customers left at all. 
 

30% down in one month?

And this is the second month with the same trend. 

 

just look at the rhythmic 7 day drop off pattern. To be frank, I’ve never seen such a regular, periodic drop off pattern in a game I’ve played.  
It’s like every Sunday 10% of the player base just calls it quits.  That’s a rate of hemorrhage that should be sending major alarm bells ringing in NQHQ. 

 

The first thirty days were no better. 
 

For context, here’s my screenshot from the end of September. 
 

uvzpFI4.png

 

 

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One must look at the bright side, even if it is a single ray of sunshine in what otherwise is a nuclear winter:  Soon their will not be an PVPers harassing those of use who simply want to build in the sandbox.  Of course, it will be a short lived experience.

 

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Définition "discussion" · Conversation entre deux ou plusieurs personnes. · Communication étendue (souvent interactive) traitant d'un sujet particulier · Action de discuter...

Ceci pour dire que les discussions ici ne sont que dans un sens (joueurs), des reponses seraient, venant de NQ, un plus ^^. 

Alors ?
 

Definition "discussion" · Conversation between two or more people. · Extended (often interactive) communication dealing with a particular topic · The act of discussing...

This to say that the discussions here are only in one direction (players), answers would be, coming from NQ, a plus ^^.

So ?

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On 11/18/2022 at 4:11 PM, GreedyMutha said:

This is so incorrect, if you engaged in pvp, you'd see how underdone it is. Pvp and pve are vital elements to a virtual economy. PvP is not on the top of the list.

 

Then why did they abandon the perfectly acceptable notion of a PVP zone where those that wanted to could, and those that didn't could simply avoid.  I can not accept that destroying the work of others who are not interested in PVP is VITAL to the economy.

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1 hour ago, Messaline said:

Définition "discussion" · Conversation entre deux ou plusieurs personnes. · Communication étendue (souvent interactive) traitant d'un sujet particulier · Action de discuter...

Ceci pour dire que les discussions ici ne sont que dans un sens (joueurs), des reponses seraient, venant de NQ, un plus ^^. 

Alors ?
 

Definition "discussion" · Conversation between two or more people. · Extended (often interactive) communication dealing with a particular topic · The act of discussing...

This to say that the discussions here are only in one direction (players), answers would be, coming from NQ, a plus ^^.

So ?

 

You dream our common dream, but it has never happened.  NQ once posted a "Suggestions" board, after the 1st day, we never heard back from them... most viewed it as simply a distraction.

 

I've done better than most.  A person (name withheld) was assigned to me to help pretty up the FAQ I maintained pre-0.23.  Eventually management rejected it because it contained work-arounds to common bugs.  Why?  Because if they made it official, they would have had to acknowledge that the game had bugs... its all NQ arrogance and attitude that is killing this game.

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53 minutes ago, Pleione said:

 

Then why did they abandon the perfectly acceptable notion of a PVP zone where those that wanted to could, and those that didn't could simply avoid.

They did what, now? Isn't that exactly what the safe zone is? Have they said "for certain" that everywhere is going to be FFA PvP in the fullness of time? I missed that one. Also, I don't believe in AvA, Atmo CvC or Territorial Warfare any more (at least, I don't believe this game will survive long enough for the anaemic development effort it has available to achieve such features), so it's effectively not something I think you need worry about.

 

55 minutes ago, Pleione said:

I can not accept that destroying the work of others who are not interested in PVP is VITAL to the economy.

I think the argument is "that of Kings"... in that, if players are the sole "regulatory agency", the only regulatory mechanism is PvP/destruction, so there ought not to be any "artificial" safe havens where anti-social types can go and lick their wounds and rebuild to reinvade Ukraine again and again and again. It's not so much vital to the economy as vital to the society. Not saying the argument necessarily stands up as an absolute, and for sure Haven is going to be, well, a Haven away from PvP, for all eternity, I believe (and therefore, it's not a stretch to think there'd be a safe area in space around it too, and if you have any 100% inviolable haven, you might as well have half the game be PvP-negative).

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Scanning for something other than T1 ore on planets is deadly dull and boring, certainly not at all fun.

So, looks like I won't be mining anything other than on Haven.

 

Industry is not worth the effort, and especially not worth all the time waiting around for Temporary schematics to be produced.

Temporary Schematics are too expensive anyway.

 

This game is far less fun than it was during Beta.

 

I backed this game because it looked like a good game and was a lot of fun during Alpha, and early Beta, even through after update 0.23, right through until mining units and Temporary Schematics.

 

The Permanent Schematics were at least a challenge to fetch.

 

If we stood a chance of finding T2 ore within 30-40 scans it might be okay but 50 scans in and I've had enough of scanning for zero reward.

 

DU is supposed to be a game and games are fun but so much of DU is worse than work, it's dull and boring like working in a factory turning machines on and off etc..

 

Oh well, I've a few DACs left so we'll see if NQ can improve this game before my DACs run out.

 

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3 hours ago, Celestis said:

Scanning for something other than T1 ore on planets is deadly dull and boring, certainly not at all fun.

So, looks like I won't be mining anything other than on Haven.

 

Industry is not worth the effort, and especially not worth all the time waiting around for Temporary schematics to be produced.

Temporary Schematics are too expensive anyway.

 

This game is far less fun than it was during Beta.

 

I backed this game because it looked like a good game and was a lot of fun during Alpha, and early Beta, even through after update 0.23, right through until mining units and Temporary Schematics.

 

The Permanent Schematics were at least a challenge to fetch.

 

If we stood a chance of finding T2 ore within 30-40 scans it might be okay but 50 scans in and I've had enough of scanning for zero reward.

 

DU is supposed to be a game and games are fun but so much of DU is worse than work, it's dull and boring like working in a factory turning machines on and off etc..

 

Oh well, I've a few DACs left so we'll see if NQ can improve this game before my DACs run out.

 

 

Only 50 scans? The current champion of bad luck is, if we are to believe them, a group of half a dozen who have made nearly a thousand scans between them of Alioth, Madis and Thades and found nothing over a single digit.  And every one of their finds has been the dregs of others' T2 rosettes, much like us.

 

That was still "sort of OK" when you could "100% legitimately and not exploitationally" spam MUs... but then a week later NQ pulls a fast one and they all got kicked in the bollocks.

 

It suffices to say that only two of the six apparently continue to play.

 

The Effort / Reward mechanic in this game is skewed oh so very far in the direciton of effort.

 

It reminds me of those tedious Chinese FTP iPad farming games with the icky graphics and eerily floating tiddies... which take ages to make any progress at all... which begs the question:


Are they going to implement DLC?

 

I can see paid "scan booster" DLC which highlights general hotspot areas for 24 hours, or a "Monthly Tier+1 Mining Booster" DLC which upgrades a tile to the next Tier for a month before tapering off. Excellent value at just 0.25 DACs apiece. Arguably far more useful than a 1,000,000 XP injector DLC.

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4 hours ago, Jinxed said:

 

 

 

I can see paid "scan booster" DLC which highlights general hotspot areas for 24 hours, or a "Monthly Tier+1 Mining Booster" DLC which upgrades a tile to the next Tier for a month before tapering off. Excellent value at just 0.25 DACs apiece. Arguably far more useful than a 1,000,000 XP injector DLC.

 

I can even see a service that grands you on a specific hex an added t2/5 ore that you pay for per month but thats not pay to win kuchkuck

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6 hours ago, Jinxed said:

Only 50 scans? The current champion of bad luck is, if we are to believe them, a group of half a dozen who have made nearly a thousand scans between them of Alioth, Madis and Thades and found nothing over a single digit.  And every one of their finds has been the dregs of others' T2 rosettes, much like us.

Wow, and they call this a game!

 

Does anyone enjoy listening to that droning machine noise the scanner makes for 15 mins every time you scan a new tile?

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The game's downward pointing charts continue to point to a future where the game may not even survive 2022, never mind 2023. 

 

There's currently more people playing "Coin Flipper" -- a single player game about flipping coins. 

 

Flipping coins is more engaging than every game concept DU has struggled to implement...it has better reviews and literally has more people playing it right now than a new MMO that took 8 years to build.

 

There's over twice as many people playing "PC Building Simulator" right now. 

 

I'm not (just) saying this to be mean...but to drive home the point that NQ needs to be making drastic changes. They need to actually engage with the players that are leaving and fire the devs or managers that insist that player feedback is useless.

 

Their CEO needs to actually seem like they are doing something other than posting about web3 and crypto on LinkedIn and talking about NQ's other projects...

 

Yet...I think it'll be business as usual up until the end. So much for NQ's post-update cycle fixing oh so many things and adding all the many things that are missing. At this rate, I truly would not be shocked if the game didn't make it past 2022. 

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This game is not Dual Universe its "Time Gate : Economy Destruction. Time to tax edition"

 

The issues DU faces are the same issues from the beta. they wiped for no reason as we will soon be back to the same issue as the beta only worse.

 

You released the game in a unfinished state, why because you needed more money?

 

The economy was ruined in the beta and its ruined again. Don't learn from the beta lets just wipe it again and then do the same thing again with no changes and hope it changes. insanity?

 

PVP is a joke.

 

The economy is like fish, big orgs eat the little guys and the little guys have to join or die eventually leading to massive fall of of players and will lead to just the largest orgs fighting each other by market manipulation and just the market death when played too hard they will just use their own systems to self regulate inner trade. and any fresh blood will have no hope of playing solo or starting a new org ect.
 

I gave the warning in discord that we would see the game die in 3 months after launch, its already showing signs, soon this game will be in the same boat as worlds adrift.

 

I'm going to give you some ideas to take with a grain of salt.

 

1. Remove skill system, just trash it. if you want a skill system make it interactive with what you are doing at the time.

 

2. Systems need to be placed we need a bot economy that has a low buy order and high sell order for people to compete with to make their money

 

3.  Systems should also be placed for basic needs such as ship insurance ship renting ect ect all the basic systems you want players to make make them bot run at a high ish cost that players can try to compete with.

 

4. Bring back life into the game. Drop the pay wall start bringing in cosmetics that cost money and use that as the main money generator.

 

5. Actually listen to your community.

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51 minutes ago, Fox said:

This game is not Dual Universe its "Time Gate : Economy Destruction. Time to tax edition"

 

The issues DU faces are the same issues from the beta. they wiped for no reason as we will soon be back to the same issue as the beta only worse.

 

You released the game in a unfinished state, why because you needed more money?

 

The economy was ruined in the beta and its ruined again. Don't learn from the beta lets just wipe it again and then do the same thing again with no changes and hope it changes. insanity?

 

PVP is a joke.

 

The economy is like fish, big orgs eat the little guys and the little guys have to join or die eventually leading to massive fall of of players and will lead to just the largest orgs fighting each other by market manipulation and just the market death when played too hard they will just use their own systems to self regulate inner trade. and any fresh blood will have no hope of playing solo or starting a new org ect.
 

I gave the warning in discord that we would see the game die in 3 months after launch, its already showing signs, soon this game will be in the same boat as worlds adrift.

 

I'm going to give you some ideas to take with a grain of salt.

 

1. Remove skill system, just trash it. if you want a skill system make it interactive with what you are doing at the time.

 

2. Systems need to be placed we need a bot economy that has a low buy order and high sell order for people to compete with to make their money

 

3.  Systems should also be placed for basic needs such as ship insurance ship renting ect ect all the basic systems you want players to make make them bot run at a high ish cost that players can try to compete with.

 

4. Bring back life into the game. Drop the pay wall start bringing in cosmetics that cost money and use that as the main money generator.

 

5. Actually listen to your community.

 

I really like 1.  Learning "talents" while not doing anything is amusing, but makes no sense.  Miners learn by mining...  Industry experts/crafters by doing...

 

I'd add a 0. "Write some lore that makes sense, then make sure the game fits the lore"

 

3. would be great.  It pisses me off to lose cargo - but I should be able to insure my ship and at least get that back.  Then being ganked becomes a learning experience instead of a violation.

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Hello, I would like to know if a PVE system is planned because as a new player going to the PVP zone to come across players with years of experience can quickly be very frustrating when you know nothing about it. There is no worthwhile training available other than in VR which frankly is pretty much useless in real life.
Think about new players or those who would like to discover the game... Many have stopped because they suffered frustration or boredom and that's a shame because the game has potential.
Thanks
Have a good day

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1 hour ago, LeMurphy said:

Hello, I would like to know if a PVE system is planned because as a new player going to the PVP zone to come across players with years of experience can quickly be very frustrating when you know nothing about it. There is no worthwhile training available other than in VR which frankly is pretty much useless in real life.
Think about new players or those who would like to discover the game... Many have stopped because they suffered frustration or boredom and that's a shame because the game has potential.
Thanks
Have a good day

NQ implementing game A.I...

 

This I gotta see.

 

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On 11/23/2022 at 12:46 PM, LeMurphy said:

Hello, I would like to know if a PVE system is planned because as a new player going to the PVP zone to come across players with years of experience can quickly be very frustrating when you know nothing about it. There is no worthwhile training available other than in VR which frankly is pretty much useless in real life.
Think about new players or those who would like to discover the game... Many have stopped because they suffered frustration or boredom and that's a shame because the game has potential.
Thanks
Have a good day

Since I truly understand

were you're coming from with your request, I have to say, I hope that NQ will at least stick to their earlier announcement about game direction and keep
there promise once. Being not offensive or something, only I backed that game, because it was told it'll become a hardcore PVP game with a playerbase driven economy further down the road, so how that would work for your request asking for a singleplayer mode in DU? Correct it won´t at all.
I´m not blaming you at all, because you have some valid points in your request, but I'm referring to statements made by NQ, mostly JC, that the game will be oriented towards the PVP based play style, that's why there were at first only a safe zone planned around Alioth, yes you read correct, ONLY around Alioth, no word about Sanctuary, where most of all the pve dudes hid their industry during beta, nor even a word about Haven, but then NQ broke down already, because of all the QQ and implemented the safe zone around Alioth region far down till Madis and Thades

sector, that made you PvE oriented players able to roam around and fly through the safe system sector. If you need stuff not finding in the safe zone, you easily can create a mission and request stuff hauled by others and pay the price, you don't like that or don't want to pay, take the risk and step your foot into the empty PVP zone yourself, it's part of the game, and it should stand as "No pain no gain".

So I'm sorry to say but" If NQ decides to bring a single player mode, the game is dead in the water by then, if not already, after all the bad decisions made by the development team in the past."
 
The industry broke by implementing decaying single use schematics instead of taking the risk to fly to dangerous places and planets deep inside the PvP zone to obtain them once for a high price. Where´re our planets anyway NQ, Teoma and Jago for a month now, are you joking NQ, this is release status, not beta!?
The market is broke forced by NQ first offering bigger organizations to create infinite quanta by flying collected flower hex mining unit re- calibrating stuff in insane quantities to market bots. The mission system was already a poor coded joke and now even got halted permanently without further notice. Oh wait the holy grail still exsists, the 180K mission, for brain dead zombie pilots and Gforce Now still possible to use while printing infinent amounts of quantas.

To sum it up, I really hope, the NQ team at least stick to their agenda once, or have to deal with the incoming consequences soon enough.

Till then
I call that situation most of the day sarcastically " Yes, DU is ready for release and ofc a monthly paid subscription game type model."


Have a good day and still a lot fun while playing DU your way.
DU the special game we all care about so much.:)

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1 hour ago, NoBadCompany said:

Being not offensive or something, only I backed that game, because it was told it'll become a hardcore PVP game with a playerbase driven economy further down the road, so how that would work for your request asking for a singleplayer mode in DU? Correct it won´t at all.

Whoever told you this has been rewriting history. The original kickstarter for DU never said the game would be mainly focusing on PvP. The main focus was always on making a open world civilization building game.

 

The official kickstarter title for the game is "Dual Universe :: Civilization Building Sci-Fi MMORPG"

And here is a quote of every sentence that mention PvP in the kickstarter campaign.

 

Quote

Emergent gameplay: economy, trade, territories, politics and warfare are all player-driven. Both PvP and non-PvP will be possible.

 

Quote

Safe Zones will protect you, and avoid Dual Universe to become a free for all PvP game. However, PvP will be possible when you step out of the Safe Zone. Players will be able to fight each other, balancing their equipment and energy between shield and armor, with dedicated weapon type with different types of damage. We will provide a “lock & fire” mechanism to combat, to facilitate very large battles that are made possible in-game by our Continuous Single-Shard Cluster. Players can further specialize into certain weapons through skills and improve their combat prowess with better equipment.

 

And if you google Dual Universe here is the first information NQ has about the game.

image.png.f8bcf5f3efa4cf1d72420a94e7706494.png

 

So.. Does this sound like a hardcore PvP game to you?

 

Edit:

And the thing I keep coming back to that I find fascinating is that while you won't find any builders arguing against there being PvP in the game. Instead what they they are saying that it should be possible to enjoy the game without doing PvP as promised in the kickstarter.

 

Some PvP'ers on the other hand seem utterly incapable of seeing anyone wanting to play a game without PvP, and have no problem arguing for tearing down everything people spend months building and belittling people by calling them "carebears" etc.

 

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8 minutes ago, CptLoRes said:

Whoever told you this has been rewriting history. The original kickstarter for DU never said the game would be mainly focusing on PvP. The main focus was always on making a open world civilization building game.

 

The official kickstarter title for the game is "Dual Universe :: Civilization Building Sci-Fi MMORPG"

And here is a quote of every sentence that mention PvP in the kickstarter campaign.

 

 

 

And of you google Dual Universe here is the first information NQ has about the game.

image.png.f8bcf5f3efa4cf1d72420a94e7706494.png

 

So.. Does this sound like a hardcore PvP game to you?

 

Good findings, but I think my points are still valid, where does it mention a possiblity to use a single player mode.
Single-shard sandbox -->MMORPG<-- stands for Massively Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Game.

All I did, was explaining, that the game universe was not meant to roam freely to every location without risk, which I still think is a main focus of the game, call it hardcore pvp direction orientated or what ever you may like, it still stands for, you need to interact with others and have deal with the included consequences. Pretty much end of story.

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11 minutes ago, NoBadCompany said:

Good findings, but I think my points are still valid, where does it mention a possiblity to use a single player mode.
Single-shard sandbox -->MMORPG<-- stands for Massively Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Game. End of story.

And again that is not what the kickstarter said. Bottom line is that the DU we got, is something that is not even close to what we where promised both for PvP and non-PvP players.

 

Quote

Team-up or go solo!

While we strongly encourage team play, in Dual Universe you are totally free to go your own way solo, or team up with others to go further. Take a spaceship for example: the game experience can range from being a lone pirate pilot in a custom made ship, to joining a crew of 100 players aboard a giant battleship that has been built in a huge industrial complex run by thousands of players. Each end of the spectrum has its unique advantages and brings exciting new gameplay experiences.

 

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9 minutes ago, CptLoRes said:

And again that is not what the kickstarter said.

 

 

Sorry but that´s now way under my paygrade, I made my point and I even responded to your post, but now you´re trying to bring up a posting section referring to being a priate pilot to make a point?
So tell me, how such a scenario would work in your opinion in a singleplayer mode DU game, without any kind of npc, are you trying to tell me, that poor pirate should fight Alphelia to become a successful pirate, or shoot the incoming pets?

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There must be some confusion here.

 

I am talking about solo players in the MMO here, and I thought you did also. And I think that was what LeMurphy was talking about also with regard to PVE.

 

But if you mean an actual dedicated single player version of the game, then absolutely that will never happen for many reasons.

 

 

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