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PLANNED HONEYCOMB CHANGES - Discussion thread


NQ-Nyota

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Others have already pointed out how out-of-touch this change is, but I have to add my voice too.

 

Really, NQ? Can we please have some semblance of reality in the relation between the HC types? This cookie-cutter version is just....sad.

 

Welcome to DU where we build space ships in concrete, wood and carbon fibre!

 

 

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i dislike the change aswell.

the differences are waaay too big.

and marble super lightweight? haha good one! (just one of many stupid examples)

 

i was thinking of a different system.

-smaller difference of stats

-more realistic

-talent based specialization

 

talents that improve the stats of a specific honeycomb if your own factory produces it. like more HP or less weight, better resistances etc. whatever you like.

a ship with fully improved T1 materials should be on the same lvl or better as a T2 ship without improved materials.

 

maybe a stupid idea, i have no clue

Edited by Niemand
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This:
Not gonna happen.

Many constructs have so complex Honeycomb or so much that this is just impossible.
 

Quote

 We have identified an issue related to the recomputing of honeycomb on constructs following the honeycomb mass change, specially with blueprints and existing constructs. To resolve this issue, you can simply remove and replace the honeycomb in chunks across a construct to recompute the mass manually. It is likely this issue will remain until the launch. 

 

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1 hour ago, Niemand said:

i dislike the change aswell.

the differences are waaay too big.

and marble super lightweight? haha good one! (just one of many stupid examples)

 

i was thinking of a different system.

-smaller difference of stats

-more realistic

-talent based specialization

 

talents that improve the stats of a specific homycomb if your own factory produces it. like more HP or less weight, better resistances etc. whatever you like.

a ship with fully improved T1 materials should be on the same lvl or better as a T2 ship without improved materials.

 

maybe a stupid idea, i have no clue

Maybe you testing more. My first hit with a T4 L laser, mixed talents, on a noibium (T5) wall destroys 9,7 m^3  voxel. If you want to protect your elements or find time for venting that's a big hole. We doesn't need more realisim, we need a playable game which is easy to understand and fun to play. For smaller weapons the stats are ok, but for L weapons they seem not different enough. A modification with talents could be a way but it makes the system more confusing.

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Honestly, I didn't really like the honeycomb changes, it took quite a bit of realism out of the building aspect, and I really liked the realism aspect of this game. I understand things need balancing and well, even though some things like the max speed cap and floor aren't very realistic, I understand they are balance etc, now HC mass should not me messed with. If you guys want to balance it, why not do it by only changing resistances and HP? We don't need any more dumbed-down systems on his game.

 

2 hours ago, Deathknight said:

NQ, why do you ask for our input (and why do we waste our time on it) when there is zero response and you go ahead with every change regardless?

 

I have to agree with @Deathknight here, I'm honestly tired of those "discussion" threads where you ask us about feedback but it goes nowhere, feels like we're just here talking with the walls or a door. I understand you all want to be more "open" and in-touch with the community, but if you're not going to do anything with feedback just don't ask for it, it's gonna save everyone's time.

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I understand that realism isn't really a priority here, balance is.

 

That is ok.

 

But the mass change such that we no longer have any metallic honeycombs to work with purely for aesthetics without making our ships heavy as sin... I don't understand.

 

As DJ Slicer said, at least give us aluminium, an already popular honeycomb for non-pvp use, back down to the ~25 territory. Or better yet, give us a metallic honeycomb in the decorative category, with extremely low weight, but no PvP viability.

 

It's a pretty hefty hit to our ability to make fancy looking space ships, that look like space ships, and can still fly well.

 

Unless you really want all of our ships built entirely out of wood, marble, and concrete?

 

Don't get me wrong, I love that we have the *option* to use some of those fancier honeycombs purely for aesthetics now... But... Space ships should mostly be metal =D

Edited by Koruzarius
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I am also very disappointed that this has gone through without explanation. I feel ignored. Why ask for feedback if you aren't going to address or utilize it. We deserve an explanation on why aluminum and carbon's weight was not swapped. Why do we no longer have a metal to build with as a primary build material?  At least answer your feedback. Silence and no changes is not an answer. You left us on Read. Ghosted.

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Dear Devs,

I don't understand.

are you trying to troll us all? Have you ever seen an airplane made out of concrete? Can you guess why not? 

I try to keep a positive attitude. Sometimes I have to try really really hard. 

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1 hour ago, Tordan said:

Dear Devs,

I don't understand.

are you trying to troll us all? Have you ever seen an airplane made out of concrete? Can you guess why not? 

I try to keep a positive attitude. Sometimes I have to try really really hard. 

Yeah. I agree. I love the previous method. It made more sense and it added so much to building. (really it did) But I can suspend reality for the sake of pvp balance I suppose. I do have other ideas like add Lithium to the low low weights as it is now an F tier material and no longer unique. But I don't understand why we no longer have a metal in the buildable weight range. That is a massive problem. It 100% unavoidable with no impact. But also change the name to plaster from concrete would be great. 

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So.. I got home and took out my two main flyers, Kestrel ftl and Loaded X-13 mk2 both of which are primarily aluminum. I didn’t test them at max load, but on general performance, they still handled well. Didn’t try the aluminum warp shuttle yet… plastic being the secondary material in a lot of ships already will help make up some of the difference. Not saying it wasn’t a bad move, because it was, and it’s another blow to the era of pretty ships that fly well. -but I don’t think aluminum ships are going extinct from this.

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Yeah, maybe aluminum ships won't go extinct. I did try to rework some of my ships with the light materials (carbon fiber, marble, etc). In most cases, I could not find a suitable replacement. It just doesn't look how it was intended with the textures available. So I switched back to aluminum in those cases.

 

The issue I have is this continued practice to impact several other areas of the game while trying to "fix" something else. If you keep using this solution of fixing one part of the game by 100% ignoring the consequences elsewhere, you are going to impact parts of the game that are in good shape to the point where they are worse than the thing you are trying to fix. The simple solution that ignores all the consequences cannot be the go to choice every single time.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 8/18/2022 at 6:17 PM, Tordan said:

Dear Devs,

I don't understand.

are you trying to troll us all? Have you ever seen an airplane made out of concrete? Can you guess why not? 

I try to keep a positive attitude. Sometimes I have to try really really hard. 

 

You fly the wrong airlines my friend. It is all about Italian marble and rich mahogany these days.

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5 minutes ago, Deathknight said:

 

You fly the wrong airlines my friend. It is all about Italian marble and rich mahogany these days.

Whoa, you paid to import your marble?  I just made mine out of stuff I dug up if memory serves.  Though memory hasn't been as reliable since I lost all my marbles.

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  • NQ-Nyzaltar unpinned this topic
  • 1 month later...

Today I would like to highlight the issue related to section calculations on ships with a highlighting of the various topics that talk about it.
 

The community has been raising this issue for many months or years.
 

Despite the consensus that some things need to be done: Nothing has been done.
 

We have long been in a gloomy silence.
 

I don't mean to insult the NQ devs, I know they work hard.
We have only one culprit on the head within this studio who seems to deliberately block this subject with his only approval and let it be said: he has nothing to do with PvP.
 

We are in a voxel construction game!
 

WE NEED TO USE VOXELS ON OUR SHIPS.
 

Is it that hard to understand ?!

IMG_20221109_225259.png

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I love that Stainless Steel is only slightly heavier than Aluminium... so cool. all those extra colours. LOL

 

This game...                                               <-->                                                       ...realsm.

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DU's materials science is a 20 minute placeholder*. Same as so many other things.

 

* By which I mean they spent 20 minutes chucking something together as a placeholder in alpha and haven't done any proper thinking about how it should work to enhance gameplay and worldbuilding since.

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I feel that, like the vast majority of non-flight-related features in Elite Dangerous still are, this games is basically placeholders stapled together with random off the shelf parts... Just look at how inconsistent everything is. In many places, the interface and mechanics look and feel like one of those generic Korean FTP iPad games... from about two decades ago.

Shockingly bad consistency.

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2 hours ago, Jinxed said:

Shockingly bad consistency.

One bit of inconsistency that catches me out every time is that the different categories of things you can build aren't ordered the same in every place they appear. Without logging on, I can't be certain, but I'm pretty certain that they're differently presented between schematics and machines/nanocrafter.

 

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14 hours ago, Jinxed said:

I feel that, like the vast majority of non-flight-related features in Elite Dangerous still are, this games is basically placeholders stapled together with random off the shelf parts... Just look at how inconsistent everything is. In many places, the interface and mechanics look and feel like one of those generic Korean FTP iPad games... from about two decades ago.

Shockingly bad consistency.

 

Elite Dangerous or Dual Universe?  Did you skip forums?

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On 11/13/2022 at 9:14 PM, Jinxed said:

...[T]his game is ... placeholders ... with random off the shelf parts... Just look at how inconsistent everything is. In many places, the interface and mechanics look and feel ... generic...

Shockingly bad consistency.

A paraphrase of your statement, but I suspect is fairly accurate to your meaning.

 

I suspect also that despite your forum avatar sporting glasses you are not using rose tinted glasses in your examination of this game.  I prefer to flip between the two viewpoints to see the difference between what DU promises and what NQ has delivered thus far.

 

h-photo-u1?w=650&q=60&fm=jpg&fit=crop&cr

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