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[Poll] wipe or no wipe


m0rrty

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Hi peeps, guys, gals, everyone,

 

Do you know how much people share your opinion?
Is your opinion the same as the upcoming official statement of DU makers?

 

 

I think we already can see the answer, so... here are the votes:

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The most rich audience (Scrooge McDuck group ) ,

3 out of 9 votes said they want full wipe

 

Second rich group got 6 out of 19 votes to full wipe.

 

3rd group: got 5 out of 20 votes for full wipe.

 

1 of 4 newbies vote for full wipe.

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The interesting tendency is that, the more guys rich, the higher chance their desire to wipe this all.

-------

numbers are:

the richest (9), rich (19), medium rich (20), newbies(4)

no wipe(27), partial (11), full (14)

 

----------------------

Let's find out! - I have created a poll for this matter: https://forms.gle/wHwSrhSHtXWwvowQ7

Please vote and share with your friends to vote.

 

The results of the vote will be shared in this first post of this forum thread as soon as NQ will give us the answer.

Edited by m0rrty
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20 minutes ago, Shredder said:

Wipe is needed for the game to survive.

I've seen this statement often, please explain.

 

Because from my perspective, if there's a wipe-wipe, I won't be returning. Actually, I would strongly advise people against playing DU if it happens.

 

A wipe-wipe, won't change anything for 99% of the players in a month. As the same dedicated players with too much time, corp players, RL money, etc. will be in the same top positions. New players won't have a chance in hell to compete with that. In the mean time, getting started in DU for new players will be HELL! As nothing will be available that's player made, at a low price (as it is now). So leaving Haven/Sanctuary will be virtually impossible as people can't build or buy a territory control unit...

 

Look, I loved getting started with beta, but it was a completely different game then. For one, Schematics, for another planet mining or surface ore respawning. You looked at what some of the Alpha players where doing in the first weeks/months and you got inspired. Doing that again under the current restrictions wouldn't be much fun (for me) imho...

 

As for current new player being left behind? They can sell their ore, and it will be bought. Just look at the current ore sell prices, see many Sanctuary sell orders or small sell orders? Would certain people have the quanta to buy that from new players if there is a wipe-wipe? No. New players can/could often pick up nice BPCs from builder characters like Hagbard, would the be able to now? No! Because Hagbard can't produce a dispenser after the wipe-wipe, he wouldn't even be able to buy one...

 

So new players wouldn't be able to get the much wanted resources like specific tiles with ore, that's just for the big dedicated corps. Hell, 99% of the current players wouldn't be able to get to them either, unless you are a highly placed person in one of the big dedicated corps. It didn't happen with the last landwipe, it won't suddenly happen now. Scanning for a new player sounds like a good way to get started, but how exactly would you get that scanner? Those Schematics are expensive! No big corp would sell their scanners before they are done scanning themselves...

 

And if you think that there will be no new player due to the 'inequality', what would happen to new players six months down the road, a year, two years? The only similar MMO i'm familiar with that has a similar concept (of persistence) is EVE Online. When I started EVE in 2005, I was already late to the party by two years. Large corps ruled Null Sec, many have risen and fallen since then, I have never been part of that (by choice). What I have done in the last 17 years (often many years off) is control certain items on the markets or even the market in a certain section of space. The big strength of EVE is imho that even if I've taken off years, I can always get back and pick up my chars where I left them. Doing new things, trying the old things in a different environment, etc. NQ has already pretty much said that if no subscription, then everything not on Sanctuary (and I expect Haven) will go POOF!(tm) eventually. The problem is that people are not trusting NQ enough at the moment that even the Sanctuary/Haven space will be save from deletion (eventually), people are not trusting NQ because they might wipe-wipe again. There goes the whole persistence concept...

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17 minutes ago, Nosomu said:

I hope NQ doesn’t wipe then I can use all my quanta to buy DACs and play for free for months or years even if that hurts their bottom line

 

If you have lots of quanta to buy DAC:s it will help NQs economy.

Because someone needs to buy those DAC:s first from NQ using real money.

Only after someone has bought DAC:s from NQ with real money and imported those into game markets you can buy them using Quanta.

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20 minutes ago, kulkija said:

 

If you have lots of quanta to buy DAC:s it will help NQs economy.

Because someone needs to buy those DAC:s first from NQ using real money.

Only after someone has bought DAC:s from NQ with real money and imported those into game markets you can buy them using Quanta.

Well, you forget that from the KS, there will be 30.000+ DACs incoming into the economy.

It would be curious to know how much quanta a single DAC will be worth, 400-500 million quanta per DAC? I didn't back the KS, so I won't be getting any DAC initially. I also expect that just buying a years subscription will be more efficient...

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1 hour ago, Cergorach said:

Well, you forget that from the KS, there will be 30.000+ DACs incoming into the economy.

It would be curious to know how much quanta a single DAC will be worth, 400-500 million quanta per DAC? I didn't back the KS, so I won't be getting any DAC initially. I also expect that just buying a years subscription will be more efficient...

I did not forget those. They are just part of the picture.

 

That situation is temporary and it is only some of those DAC which come for sale at markets. Even those DACs were paid with real money as a bonus for KS pledge.

 

I did pledge at kick starter. So I have 20 DACs / 20 months of playtime already paid.

 

But why I would sell them to gain Quanta? If I do so, lets say I sell all of them after launch. Then I need to buy new DACs right away.

Why I would sell DAC:s to get quanta?

 

If there is wery interesting ships or bases as token or BP for sale I may sell some of my DACs

After wipe there is none.

Selling kick-starter DACs to get quanta is zero sum situation.

 

If there will be no wipe, there will be players with lots of quanta willing to buy DAC:s

There will be also lots of interesting stuff to buy if you have Qs

Also there will be new players with almost no quanta. But wanna buy that interesting stuff.

What they do:

They buy extra DACs to be able to sell them at in-game markets to get quanta and to be able to buy interesting stuff earlier.

Now winner is NQ as DACs are sold more.

 

Game will survive only if there is lots of interesting content at launch. Wipe takes all content away and will kill the game.

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To be honest, when the game is "released" the only thing that will keep me in the game is the kickstarter DAC's.

Simply because there is NOTHING currently in this game that I would pay a subscription to play. So in effect NQ will have as long as my DAC's last, to improve the game enough for actual subscription play.

 

And if there is a wipe, then I won't even bother using the DAC's..

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4 minutes ago, Rheuschek said:

No wipe is necessary, envy is a weakness.

I was looking for the right word, you nailed it with 'envy'! Envy is not an emotion that will go away with are whining now for a wipe, there is never pleasing these kinds of people unless they are the ones on top of the food chain. So I have a tens of millions of talent points, and a decent amount of ore/quanta/etc. Compared to a new player that's a LOT! But I've been playing this game and paying for that privilege for a year and a half now, if it all goes POOF!(tm) at launch I'll feel a different emotion... Namely Wrath... 😉

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Blanket wipe/no wipe is not something I would select. My desire for a wipe hinges on if missions are fixed or not. If they are appropriately nerfed, the game needs wiped. If they are not, there is no reason to wipe.

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I was watching DU ads on youtube. I wish we were getting that game instead of the one we're getting.

 

The game is already just barely worth playing. With a wipe, I don't think it will be worth messing with it. My main bases can't be deployed from BPs with the current state of BPs. So I can't realistically recover from a wipe.

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A poll on the wipe is meaningless as NQ has made the decision some time ago and it's really hard to not expect to see that wipe happening for a number of pretty obvious business reasons. 

 

For one, not announcing a "no wipe" makes no sense at all which points to a wipe coming. Effectively, most of us who are in favour of a wipe will not agree to it not happening but would not threaten to "leave the game" because of it. That said, a majority of "no wipe" campers are just making empty threats I am sure and will stay on with the rest of us when the wipe happens. So, if a no wipe was decided there really is nothing that would make sense to not announce it well in advance

 

The game being reset just prior to launch makes sense at it is a justifiable expectation for incoming players AT LAUNCH to enter a cleared world and not the massive mess we see now i many placed.

 

Then, the expiring beta keys will need to see their assets removed from game for one and NQ will seek opportunity to incentivise these accounts to convert to a subscription. A wipe and head-start is a good tool for that.

 

The notion that abandonment will fix the above really is not justified, it will only mean that some players will have a massive lead going into launch which also goes back to the first point. And no, this is not the same as resetting each year after launch.. 

 

NQ really has only once said there would not be further wipes in a press release around beta, every single comment or indication around this has left a wipe squarely on the table.

 

 

I can see one possible reason for NQ to hold back on the no wipe and that is they may be trying to get the new planet design into the game at launch, that would guarantee the need for a wipe and they may want to be sure they can/can't add that for launch before making the announcement.


Anyway, a wipe would not be a full one as prior to beta because that is not something NQ can do as they have started charging players for access and they can’t take specifically the accrued talent points away so these will go back to the pool.
 

 

Finally, “a level playing field” is not an argument or issue here. Too many try and pull that in to dismiss the wipe. This is not about that at all as even on a full wipe, the pre-launch players will have a massive advantage over new players and the talent points will only seriously amplify that.

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50 minutes ago, blazemonger said:

The game being reset just prior to launch makes sense at it is a justifiable expectation for incoming players AT LAUNCH to enter a cleared world and not the massive mess we see now i many placed.

 

Game launch - that's generally the time when access is given to the general public.
Does the general public have access to DU? Yes - I'm a paying customer since May 2021.

The "game launch" you speak of is just a marketing ploy. It is not the grand opening of the flood gates to the millions of eagerly awaiting enthusiasts who did not manage to secure a limited spot in a closed beta. In other words, few players are waiting to jump to DU when it "launches".

For Dual Universe the beginning of the "Open beta" was its true and only Game Launch.

So for the people playing DU right now this "game launch" has as much relevance as does the rain over the ocean for the fishes swimming in it.
My conservative estimate for a split between current players and new players post-"launch" is 90/10. As in 90% of players will be the existing players.

When you see it that way, you'll understand that screwing 90% of the user-base for the expectations of the 10% will be a stake through NQ's heart.

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4 hours ago, Owl_Superb said:

 

Game launch - that's generally the time when access is given to the general public.
Does the general public have access to DU? Yes - I'm a paying customer since May 2021.

The "game launch" you speak of is just a marketing ploy. It is not the grand opening of the flood gates to the millions of eagerly awaiting enthusiasts who did not manage to secure a limited spot in a closed beta. In other words, few players are waiting to jump to DU when it "launches".

For Dual Universe the beginning of the "Open beta" was its true and only Game Launch.

So for the people playing DU right now this "game launch" has as much relevance as does the rain over the ocean for the fishes swimming in it.
My conservative estimate for a split between current players and new players post-"launch" is 90/10. As in 90% of players will be the existing players.

When you see it that way, you'll understand that screwing 90% of the user-base for the expectations of the 10% will be a stake through NQ's heart.

 

I am the fish swimming here for more than a year, I am paying for the game since I started. I am making ~10kTon expensive ore a week spending 2h on it only, I am rich in the game. 

But I name things as they are, - the release is release, and now it is not yet 'launched'. We are in the test environment, I do not think this as a true game launch, why should it be? - I was warping ktons of missions in the past, do you think it is fare to others? I don't think so.

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Fix the game and wipe it out! Not wiping it out only maintains the terrible imbalance that is created by the broken game!

 

I am always open to coming back to DU, but that is only after they fixed it! I can say that this game have a potential to be a viable game after assessing the available and upcoming MMOs!

 

Right now, I am playing nothing because I am disappointed on the quality of MMOs (especially on their lack of contents). Due to the terrible and deteriorating state of our genre, DU stands a chance in the market, only if they will get the game fixed! A game that is fixed is worth a second go!

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14 hours ago, Rheuschek said:

Terrible slanted poll.  There are really only 2 achieved asset options, weighted with negative connotation.  No wipe is necessary, envy is a weakness.

I am not familiar with your connotation, sorry on that. But answers are neutral. The assets question (with answers newbie/average/rich/extremally rich ) is just to give a brief understanding on the group that has voted in the 1st question. Sorry, in case you do not like scrooge mcduck cartoon.

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23 hours ago, Shredder said:

Pretty pointless poll as the majority of people that still play are builders. 
 

Wipe is needed for the game to survive.

 

14 hours ago, Rheuschek said:

Terrible slanted poll.  There are really only 2 achieved asset options, weighted with negative connotation. 

 

No wipe is necessary, envy is a weakness.

 

At least people share the same opinion and are definitely sure on the fact that you don't like the poll 🙂

Sorry if anything, I definitely don't want to make fight on this, I wish just to know how people think ( without names, behind the poll ).

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7 hours ago, Owl_Superb said:

When you see it that way, you'll understand that screwing 90% of the user-base for the expectations of the 10% will be a stake through NQ's heart.

 

If 90% of the currently paying playerbase is effectively a handful of people, creeating better oppportunity to draw in many, many more by performing a wipe will offset the loss of a few quite easily. And as said, anyone currently playing, especially if you play with agroup, will have a massive advantage once the wipe happens. By actually working a s a group and organizing a structural training plan for talents in the group, you will have a greatly functional org very quickly again.

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Wipe will mean NQ cannot fix any issues in long term perspective which is bad If we think about playing DU in this long term perspective. NQ needs to learn how to fix the issues by introducing new game systems/loops/mechanics like other longterm projects do. Wipe wont help with that is just a temporary hype solution and then we will be back with new unresolved issues.

Edited by Vilhelm
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1 hour ago, Vilhelm said:

Wipe will mean NQ cannot fix any issues in long term perspective which is bad If we think about playing DU in this long term perspective. NQ needs to learn how to fix the issues by introducing new game systems/loops/mechanics like other longterm projects do. Wipe wont help with that is just a temporary hype solution and then we will be back with new unresolved issues.

I agree that wipe helps with hype, which helps boost initial numbers, but there also needs to be additional gameplay loops within 6k on this of launch to keep them.

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I do not get the fairness argument. Non PVP there is no true progression. PVP is talent and exotic weapon gated.  I have never ran one mission and could care less someone who did and even alt abused it has billions.

 

I started at beta launch (paid accounts) with a group of friends that bailed after a month. I have solo grinder since and focused on non mission money making for a factory and just recently got my first warp beacon. I do not want a wipe of any kind.

 

For those that want a wipe imho it would have to be literally everything. For instance if talents were retained PVP players have huge advantage day 1.

 

Those who are about  fairness those that have the fancy lua scripts would have a monster advantage and be in a position to leap ahead (whatever ahead means).

 

those that say all the good tiles are taken. In the last two months I was able to snag a five tile cluster 30 km from market 6 and just this week found some T5 to drop a my on.

 

if it is about the fresh land and ore rush first to space etc, it will not be the newbies, it will be the vets first to best tiles, first to space, first for scanners, first to the pvp dominance.  There is zero sense to wipe to level for new players.

 

I personally will not grind again. I am but one person but I can see zero benefit to wipe to bring new players as the vets will be right back to where they are now much faster than you may expect.

 

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On 4/12/2022 at 6:31 AM, m0rrty said:

Hi peeps, guys, gals, everyone,

 

Do you know how much people share your opinion?
Is your opinion the same as the upcoming official statement of DU makers?

 

Let's find out! - I have created a poll for this matter: https://forms.gle/wHwSrhSHtXWwvowQ7

Please vote and share with your friends to vote.

 

The results of the vote will be shared in this first post of this forum thread as soon as NQ will give us the answer.

 

Thank you!

m0rrty

We are in this wipe or no wipe scenario for 2 years. This is 100+ topic/post/poll about Wipes. They do their thing you do your thing!

 

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