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DEVBLOG: PANACEA 'REMEDIES" ON THE WAY - Discussion thread


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13 hours ago, DevilsOwn said:

I'm not getting why some ppl think the MUs are responsible for the low ore prices... My MUs don't generate that much ore... But mining asteroids does. And the drop in prices af the weekends shows that too. IMO it's having asteroids spawn only in weekends that causes everybody to rush out and mine them all (safe zone), and then flood the market. Spreading out the roids over the week would remove this "gold rush" and flooding every weekend.

 

THIS.  So much wisdom in this reply.  

 

In my opinion, T1 isn't even needed to spawn in asteroids at this point in time.  We may reach a point (unless a ore reset is done...) where asteroids will be the only way to get T1 due to the planets being milked, but until that time (probably a long way off), asteroids should only spawn T2 - T5.

 

My personal journey with the MU's is that I'm overflowing with T1 ore.  If you find the "magic 7" of 300L+, and plant them with MU's, you'll be swimming in ore, forcing to sell to bots.  I haven't mined too much T2 & T3 (because of lack of finding good tiles on my planet), so the dropoff from T1 to those is pretty significant.

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My whole thing about this update is piling on more and more ore production with nothing to do with it or any real means to take it out of the game in any meaningful or impactful way without just layering on more and more sinks or punishments since NQ does not know what to do to make any of this work properly.

 

MU's were a chore/job as is and yet instead of removing the chrages they through "Quality of Life Improvements" want to turn MUs into 1/3 more of a chore/job since you can further expand your mining opperation since you can opperate more MUs, and on top of it via harvesting you will get more ore per calibration, ground rock harvesting, and it will destroy the economy just that much more faster than its plummiting now.

 

Since ore does not matter, parts dont matter, and we keep churning otu more and more junk than anyone really needs, wants, or does not already spec mass produce via industry already it really is kind of pointless if they dont really take anything out of the game. I often call mining in this game the root of all evils as it first held the game back with the finite ore pool race to stripmine the game before the geometry reset, and now we have traded onworld mining for filling the landscape with the same amount of voxels, elements, etc since we have infinite ore nobody wants or needs and nothing better to do than fill up as many cores with junk nobody will visit since there is no real purpose to building things other than industry or mass buying tiles for mining opperations for no real reason when it all could have been done in a minimal amount of tiles or MUs that actually mined decent amounts which again turns into sky mining and filling space with more junk.

 

Proper sinks further turn the game into a chore but I really think that Charges need to go as the efficiency limiter and be replaced by fuel consumption for all forms of mining so it costs something to get something moreso than taxes. Mining tools should cost Nitron to harvest onworld and Kergon should be used for asteroid mining. I also think that players should really need to use oxigen in space or underwater to also further slow down people or make use of the thousands or hundreds of thousands of KL of oxigen people have no other use for.

 

But also that they should really bring back Destructive Elements that is either 1 death or the first death is free kind of approach which should include cores since the first time cores skyrocketed in price. That was a good way to take a lot of elements out of circulation and it kept the market pretty healthy.

 

Really there is no real risk in this game or environmental factors involved that add any element of danger. Rotating asteroids, wind, hostile environments, etc that slows down how much we can gain or that how much is leaving the game. It does not need to be made into a survival game as much as it is sort of needed as a solar system should be a brutal punishing and unforgiving place in general and not a complete goldylocks zone of total enhabitable exoplanets. 

 

But also that PvP in of itself is completely optional or avoidable and by large has no point when ships cost too much to just throw away with PvP being put solely on the backs of players and orgs. PvP beyond the sparce blockade has no real bearing or impact on the game beyond the random small scale combat or predatory gank here and there. If NQ wants to make it a think they are actually going to have to develop that part of the game to do so and to give meaning to the economy to take elements out of the game rather than just making sinks and punishments.

 

They really need to decelop some kind of planetary residency system as all ores are barely stategic if you can live or set up a base on every planet, mine all ores with your org, and stockpile or mass prodece, sell items with no end game goal in mind for getting rid of them. On top of taxation without representation or real purpose to taxes being levied other than griefing new players or small orgs it needs a lot of work to turn into into a full fledged pipline feature of the game.

 

Such as creating planetary residency system or group of planets that are part of alliances of planet faction like orgs that allow players or orgs to be bound to a specific set of planets that is completely optional. Joining a planetary alliance should make all players unable to PvP alliance members but offers orgs within the alliance for miners, industrialists, logistics, and police/military sub alliance orgs to bind themselves to if they dont want to opperate independantly.

 

To which all taxes collected serve a purpose in funding missions for the different sub alliance orgs that players can join all 4 if they want in their chosen alliance to pay for ore shipments, turning the ore into products, moving it to ship dry docks that act like industry to build fleet ships, and then the PvP orgs take those ships and fight other planetary alliances to ease the burden of PvPing from players and orgs to using the actual taxes collected to use the actual economy and talents of roles players already like doing and completing the gameplay loop so that throwing away dozens or multiple dozens of ships per night is a fun experience rather than potentially game ending if you lose a hauler worth multiple hundreds of millions on top of the hundreds of millions of cargo vs mass quantities of ore/elements already bought and paid for by the alliance and protected by the alliances as it is in everyone's interest to do so as a primary feature of transporting, escorting, or getting revenge or assaulting other alliance transports.

 

Until that happens layering on more and more ore production with no end goal makes this game more and more pointless other than just filling the world up with stuff until you hoard as much as you can with nothing to use it on, nobody to really fight, and a graveyard of bored players who have passed on to better games this game origionally wanted to mimic.

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Some good and some poor changes.

 

What is DU?  Is DU a civ building game sandbox or autominer with minecraft building?  The Civ is out of DU IMO.

 

See PvP as said by Pann/Deckard was all about if you want the best reward it wont be safe.  Now literally you dont need to mine roids thus PvP is defacto dead, boomed, ended...... I may as well pick up that 5l per hour T10l per hour T5 hexes as well I can spam so many more of them!.  As much as Legion are the dominant force as an alliance it has been fun clashing with them at asteroids and skirmishes around mission hubs.  This just pushes it more to why bother.

 

I guess I struggle to see from the original vision of one safe area, building alliances, building ships/warships etc and potentially clashing but equally someone can trade, build and feed those wars.

 

Perhaps with all this ore we need voxels to play a part on ships again (ore used in armour and blown off) or decay of elements so we need to replace elements from time to time in non-pvp to help stimulate the economy.  Btw I am not wholly against cheap ore prices as to me prices now for ore are fine and it is a bit like the old days.  We just need a use for that ore that also disappears by other means.

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We tell you that we don't like an element of your game, instead of removing it because we don't like it you just try and make it more tolerable. 

 

So many anti player updates in this game it is no wonder it is struggling. I want to love DU, and at one time I did. But you keep [filtered] punching your community

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This is indeed a step in the right direction.

Would it have been better to have listened to the community earlier, yes absolutely, many of the changes you are implemented were suggested during the Public Test for Demeter. That's what player testing is for, to listen, adapt, and then implement, not push through something regardless of feedback.

I hope in the future you follow the feedback before you implement something your player base is warning you about. 

That said, good work, keep raising the bar.

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23 hours ago, OrionSteed said:

I haven't mined too much T2 & T3 (because of lack of finding good tiles on my planet), so the dropoff from T1 to those is pretty significant.

 

Leave your planet. It's a big universe out there.

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Just like throw my hat in and Suggest additional improvements.

 

 

1. The mining units mining pool is base off the tile the static core is built on.  It should be the one that the mining unit is place on. What this would allow is you to cover up to 3 tiles with one static core instead of 3 cores.  This also allow you to connect your industry machines up to 3 tiles of mining instead of one. Save on your core limit (special for people with multiple tiles).  This would be great quality of life improvement and I would think easy to implement. 

 

2. My first may be easier to implement but I think this would far greater improvement to game.  Make all your connect tiles pools connect together. You could place all your miners in one place but still mine off your other tiles.  You could feed all your miners into your industry. Only need one static core. This would save a ton of time for calibrations because all your miners in one spot. If this cant be implement for  technical reasons. Then connect all adjacent tiles mining pool or as many tiles the game will allow. This would be great quality improvement for many reasons. If you add idea 2 then idea 1 is not really needed unless there limit to tile pool connection.

 

3. This improvement is work together with the 2nd suggestion. Add larger mining units that consume more chargers to calibrate.

Example:  Mining units gather and cost more calibrations by multiples of 2x, 5x, 10x, 20x.  If you have all your tiles pools connected together then you could place larger miners down and save time of calibrations because you would need less miners. Your really not gaining more ore but just huge time save because 20x mining unit equal same output as 20 normal units and cost same on calibration charges.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

im not happy with ammount of ore from mining units ,its a jouke,i like to see 10000L per hour than 86-130 per houre .130  l not covering my factories needs it all ,calibration is one more bad thing we have more calibrations but timer still 3.5 hours nothing realy chenged what i say diemeter ,panacea ,armagedon that all stay together you guis ruin the economy of the game , bring back ore> lift amount of ore form MU let people have fun 

 

Edited by Wargearer
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That's all great.
If you don't choose to generate rocks below the MUs, could we plase have a waypoint system that allows for setting half a dozen waypoints so we don't have to return to base for each new rock deposit. Actually, a waypoint system would be bloody brilliant anyway.. I find I am always opening and closing the map... the ability to choose and set a small route across half a dozen markets, MUs or player bases would be a real benefit.
  

Oh... and please, please, please could we have a small green dot on the minimap that permanently locates the direction of your active ship when you're away from it?  

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Oh great, now you're going to remove my ships on my HQ tiles on Alioth if I don't pilot them for a week!

 

Really?!

 

So it's no-longer possible to do stuff away from Alioth for even a week before our ships left back at HQ get deleted.

 

This game gets worse with every maintenance now!

 

One week!

 

So if we go on holiday or are busy or sick for a week and don't pilot all our ships on Alioth we lose them?

 

Couldn't you at least have made it a month?

 

Ok, I'll pack up all my stuff on Alioth and move it to Sanctuary....

.... but really this really does make playing this game incredibly limited.

 

What's going to happen to all of the creators who have ships on show for people to wander through?

Are they going to have to pilot all their ships once a week?

As if the frequent calibration of the mining units wasn't boring enough, now we have to routinely go round piloting all our ships on Alioth every week.

 

So much for leaving my small cargo ship back at base for running to and from the market.

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35 minutes ago, Celestis said:

Oh great, now you're going to remove my ships on my HQ tiles on Alioth if I don't pilot them for a week!

 

Really?!

 

So it's no-longer possible to do stuff away from Alioth for even a week before our ships left back at HQ get deleted.

 

This game gets worse with every maintenance now!

 

One week!

 

So if we go on holiday or are busy or sick for a week and don't pilot all our ships on Alioth we lose them?

 

Couldn't you at least have made it a month?

 

Ok, I'll pack up all my stuff on Alioth and move it to Sanctuary....

.... but really this really does make playing this game incredibly limited.

 

What's going to happen to all of the creators who have ships on show for people to wander through?

Are they going to have to pilot all their ships once a week?

As if the frequent calibration of the mining units wasn't boring enough, now we have to routinely go round piloting all our ships on Alioth every week.

 

So much for leaving my small cargo ship back at base for running to and from the market.

 

Only on Market tiles and other Aphelia owned tiles. Not HQ tiles.


 

 

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I created a spreadsheet that  automatically  plots the shortest route between spawned ore deposits. Right after calibrating multiple mining units, I follow the plotted route and collect the surface ore. For me, random deposit locations are fine.

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