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NQ-Deckard

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Since I have now given up a lot of territories and had to tear down massive amounts of buildings and outposts in order to escape the tax pressure, I am only interested in one thing about the whole new system:
 

-> Will space stations remain permanently free of any taxes or obligations for players in DualUniverse?


I would just like to keep building. No obligation for taxes or obligations to always log in, even on holiday or in hospital/rehab. 
Please, at least leave the space stations alone for peaceful builders.

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Each player will be able to assign five territories as their headquarters.

Please make it clear that this cap is for the entire universe, star system, or planet. I believe the intention was universe, and if so I think it is a reasonable number. If it is per planet, GTFO, and per star system, I'd prefer 3.

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I've been offline for a while and moved to another planet due to all the Org players quitting the game.  I want to come back but was waiting for a lot of the issues to be addressed and improvements to be implemented.  Am I right in thinking then that that actual weeks of work mining and constructing these bases on territories will firstly empty my bank account with tax then make all my buildings and equipment available for looting?

This is the first thing about this game that has truly put me off coming back if I lose all the hard work and innovation I put into this game.  I have stored 1000's of voxels ready to come back and complete a range of ships and buildings semi complete.

If this tax system is limited to Orgs then fine, but if you are forcing players to play your game or lose everything then this isn't a tactic I'm comfortable with.

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So in order to loot the territory, we'll have to pay a bribe of 500 000 moneys to the mob boss that is Aphellia, just to get the privilege of submitting a loot request paperwork in the central bureaucracy office, which starts a 2 week court proceedings during which the constructs in question can be reclaimed by their neglecting owner, thus giving us "the finger" gesture.

 

I suggest that we make this even more interesting, by making it mandatory for the looter to validate his request every hour during those two weeks by pushing the button "yes, I am sure", while optionally adding additional money gift to Aphellia to keep her mood up.

The Aphellia mood will be determined by a complex formula involving time and money submitted, which will finally be evaluated after two weeks. To get the mood results, looter should fly over (not VR) to a random point in space (PVP zone, of course) to obtain a scan of an asteroid. Then he should return the scan to Market 6, after which he will get the mood results.

The mood results can finally be delivered to the court located at the Ark ship, along with 100 kt of gold nuggets as a sacrifice to the gods.

 

 

 

 

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How will you validate that a construct on a territory that has changed owner will be accessible? Is that up to the player to report?

 

Also what happens if a player is in the process of removing a construct and the player is in build mode when the owner exchange of the construct takes place? Will the player be booted from build mode?

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Has not beed mentioned if the Headquarter can change during the game or once assigned it will not be possible to change it.

 

I suggest to don't remove the ownership to a territory because a player didn't renew the subscription, this will be very bothering for those that want to take a break from th game and if they do they may not come back if they lose their stuff.

 

Progressive taxes is the only real way to avoid players/organizations to get too many territories. If the amount of taxes will increase with the number of territories it will be more interesting to study which territory to keep and which not to keep since at one point they will not be able to "repay" their value. Different Planets/Moons should have separate taxation.

 

I want to insist on the fact that some dynamic of Demeter are going to push players to be in PVP even if they don't desired, this is a very negative thing and that a ship can't warp away if under attack witho no possibilities of defences or that didn't counterattacked it is not realistic and is very unpleasant.

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Couple questions: What about the Sanctuary tiles, is there anything special with them? Or do they also expire and lose ownership when unsubscribed?

What happens to dynamic constructs and space station cores when you unsubscribe?

And I assume we can still maneuver someone else's dynamic constructs off your territory or submit ticket for removal?

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I thought, 1 million quanta a month, and I was feeling strain on me. But now reading that it is four times more (!!!) as the tax is paid weekly and not monthly, i do not know how to generate so much money ingame. My focus is to fly around and interact, mining is not so much something i do so aggressively. And especially new players will find it hard, too, to make so much money.

Unless the start-up territories on the Sanctuary Moon have a significantly better ore output than now. hen new players won't struggle. Remember, there is no "average player", so many of us who are not loud and are known to you, are playing on a lower level, nott mining aggressively or in big groups.

Also, if all of us palyers have to start mining aggressively, won' this cause that ttoo much ore is given to the markets and prices will fall, thus making it harder to earn the quanttas needed to pay the insane territory tax?

Finally, I remind you for one of my previous suggestions in which I described a tax that is oriented on the ore output value of a territory. hat is how it should be. I urge you to reconsider.

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All the timescales sound way too short to me. Two weeks is nothing.

 

I'd like to see things a bit more stretched out. Give us a month or two with territory transfers enabled so that we can get our heads around which territories we want to keep and who needs to own what. Then a month or two more with rents enabled but no territory reclaiming / forfeiting. Let that bed in before you start throwing people off their tiles and destroying their stuff.

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@NQ why wait two weeks before you can empty / clean up an abandoned core? What's the point of this?
Make it so that the tile is abandoned after four weeks without paying tax, but then everything is immediately abandoned.
This immediately gives the lucky finder a good feeling. Even though he must first claim the tile before he can empty or clean up the core.

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So, two week if paid taxes followed by two weeks before the tile goes unowned due to non payment?

 

The only real issue with this is timing. Your adding this system while removing mining as we know it. It will take a couple weeks for the economic engine of autominers to even begin to start.  For those that are less... wealthy, this change will hurt massively initially. 

 

Require players pay taxes on tiles... while taking away players primary method for obtaining wealth. This is the real issue IMHO.

 

Please give players a proper grace period if your NOT gonna lower the tax rate.  Two/Four weeks is a bit tight. 

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5 minutes ago, DutchEasyGamer said:

@NQ why wait two weeks before you can empty / clean up an abandoned core? What's the point of this?
Make it so that the tile is abandoned after four weeks without paying tax, but then everything is immediately abandoned.
This immediately gives the lucky finder a good feeling. Even though he must first claim the tile before he can empty or clean up the core.

Because the owner will have to pay for 2 weeks of taxes in order to claim the constructs. This way it doesnt become a simple salvage all you can mechanic. Plus friends can also take the territory and not start the reclamation in order to preserve the constructs. It adds more to the gameplay and the options you have.

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1 hour ago, virtualburn said:

I've been offline for a while and moved to another planet due to all the Org players quitting the game.  I want to come back but was waiting for a lot of the issues to be addressed and improvements to be implemented.  Am I right in thinking then that that actual weeks of work mining and constructing these bases on territories will firstly empty my bank account with tax then make all my buildings and equipment available for looting?

This is the first thing about this game that has truly put me off coming back if I lose all the hard work and innovation I put into this game.  I have stored 1000's of voxels ready to come back and complete a range of ships and buildings semi complete.

If this tax system is limited to Orgs then fine, but if you are forcing players to play your game or lose everything then this isn't a tactic I'm comfortable with.

You will be allowed to claim 5 personal tile as headquarters.  These will not be impacted by Taxes but you will not loose the territory if you become inactive.  That being said your industry will stop if you dont pay your taxes. 

Edited by LosNopales
Contained incorrect information
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I think this headquarters feature is really good.

For all the players who don't want to have to pay every week for a gameplay or creative project. Or have "safe" tiles that would never go unclaimed ?.


Anyway... I think 5 is a bit much per player. I'd say more like 3 or 2 HQs per player personally.

And on top of that ... why have to wait 1 month (2 unpaid weeks+ 2 weeks to claim staic builds = 4 weeks) to be able to loot a tile ... a bit long, no?

Would this HQ functionality be limited to the safe zone? I personally think it should be to avoid squatting on T4-T5 tiles. 

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HEADQUARTERS
Each player will be able to assign five territories as their headquarters. These territories do not lose ownership when offline and remain in the players' ownership even if taxes are unpaid for longer than the two week grace period. This feature is only available to player-owned, not organization-owned, territories. We will monitor how this develops; in the future, these territories may be subject to the loss of their headquarters state if the account in question is unsubscribed; however this will not be the case in Demeter. 

 

While I'm happy to see this made it into Demeter, unless a HQ tile can't have rights set to only individuals, they will be massively abused by orgs to have free, untaxed claims to build infrastructure and potentially lock up valuable tiles which wil only have taxes paid when it is time to restock on the ores found there.

HQ tiles need to have severe restrictions on who or what can have access to the tile.

Also, I feel that there shoudl be a limit of one tile per player per planet of this kind.
 

I hope this is addressed before Demeter goes live @NQ-Deckard and @NQ-Sesch .. I fear that if that does not happen it will cause problems down the line. This is not something you'd want to "see what happens" with.

 

 

Also I think that removing the increase in cost for each tile on the same planet is a mistake.. too many have too much money to spare for a number of reasons not related to normal gameplay and this will allow these individuals to claim tiles on a massive scale with little or no impact on their wallet.

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I would like to say something about Headquarters' tiles.

Can you consider to limit the 5 tiles of HQ on the safe zone (Alioth / madis / thades)?  Many people have multiple account with beta key. So they have many many many alts (some of them have 100+ alts).

If each alt can LOCK 5 tiles, you can imagine easily how they can find a hotspot of T2 T3 T4 T5 on outer planets and lock them without tax (via HQ mecanics) and wait until they can sell the tiles or used it with MU. With a safe zone limitation there is less chance they will use it for hotspot of T1 .... alioth is plenty of T1

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7 minutes ago, Jake Arver said:

 

While I'm happy to see this made it into Demeter, unless a HQ tile can't have rights set to only individuals, they will be massively abused by orgs to have free...

This feature is only available to player-owned, not organization-owned

It written in the text you quoted ?
Anyway, I personally approve that 5 is too much, I propose to reduce to 3 tiles, but one per planet could a thing too ? And may be limit it to SZ.

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10 minutes ago, Elias Villd said:

This feature is only available to player-owned, not organization-owned

It written in the text you quoted ?
Anyway, I personally approve that 5 is too much, I propose to reduce to 3 tiles, but one per planet could a thing too ? And may be limit it to SZ.

 

So what is stopping orgs from asking their members to set the org with full rights on such a tile and place it where the org asks in exchange for .. whetever possible incentive or just as a pre-requisite to join.

 

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31 minutes ago, LosNopales said:

You will be allowed to claim 5 personal tile as headquarters.  These will not be impacted by Taxes.

HQ Tiles are not tax free, you just don't lose them if you do not pay taxes.  They become inactive.

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I'd love to see how you came up with 1,000,000 a week in taxes.  I honestly feel like this is way to high, it is to much for smaller and more casual players.  This makes me much less excited about Demeter.  I get why you need a decay system, makes perfect sense, and I agree with it, but 1 million a week is just to steep.

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