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1 hour ago, Shredder said:

If we get up to 10 calibration charges every day

With max skills we can store up to 10 calibration charges , BUT calibration charges regenerate every 3.5 hour per charge, so a little less then 7 charges per day. Note: this was the info from PTS, they might mess with Demeter on release even more.

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Ok then lets wipe underground ore.

Ok then lets wipe scans. I am in .

If in your next moves you wipe ore materials parts and quanta owned , i suspect you are targeting the players of DU who decided to first go get the mats or wealth and then enjoy the game. If you are planning to do so , are you also going to :

-Wipe blueprints-structures ?

-Wipe tile ownership (and near markets) ?

-Wipe schematics owned ?

-Wipe all talents ? 

For all players to have the same chance in advancing the game ?

Do you mean a clean start ?

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1 hour ago, Cergorach said:

With max skills we can store up to 10 calibration charges , BUT calibration charges regenerate every 3.5 hour per charge, so a little less then 7 charges per day. Note: this was the info from PTS, they might mess with Demeter on release even more.

Ah ok, so 6 or 7 recalibration every evening, that sounds about right.

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17 minutes ago, rubachet said:

Will we able to calibrate mining units in VR?

On the PTS we were able to calibrate in VR, however the talents related to calibration boost and amount of rocks that spawn are not working. At max talents that is 30% less bonus to calibration when you recalibrate.

 

Imo it's a fair trade-off. Making it possible to calibrate in VR, but not give you the benefit of some talents by doing so. This means that for "optimal output" you need to visit each mining unit in person, but it's still possible in VR if you're short on time (or have a billion alts)

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6 hours ago, Habitant said:

Ok then lets wipe underground ore.

Ok then lets wipe scans. I am in .

If in your next moves you wipe ore materials parts and quanta owned , i suspect you are targeting the players of DU who decided to first go get the mats or wealth and then enjoy the game. If you are planning to do so , are you also going to :

-Wipe blueprints-structures ?

-Wipe tile ownership (and near markets) ?

-Wipe schematics owned ?

-Wipe all talents ? 

For all players to have the same chance in advancing the game ?

Do you mean a clean start ?

 

All ill gotten games when it was easy to amass mass weath with no limits compounded by the ability to scan mass amounts of tiles that will need to be wiped even though they said otherwise resulting in complete surpemacy of the server.

 

If you dont think that needs to happen at this point buckle up.

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8 minutes ago, BartholomewBainbridge said:

Will ore types stay the same as they are on planets today, or will you completely change what ore types are on planets with the Demeter patch?

 

For example:  Madis has Bauxite, Coal, Hematite, Garnierite, Quartz and Natron - will this stay the same or is this getting changed on every planet?

Yes... No.. It's complicated! ?

 

This is what I found on PTS:

On standard tiles on Madis you get Bauxite, Coal, Hematite, and Quartz. I've heard from others that they got T2 on their scanned tiles, but I expect that this to be more rare (in ~50 scans I had none). Going further away from Alioth/Madis/Thades you get different distributions with higher tier ores more abundant, and T1 less so. I came across a moon where you had 300L/h default for Hematite, another 300L/h default for Coal.

 

Distribution and abundance will be significantly different from what we're used to. I suspect that is to promote trading across the system, especially with slow-boating (for pvp) as warping to the arse end of the system with a load of Hematite is going to be very expensive!

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3 minutes ago, Cergorach said:

Yes... No.. It's complicated! ?

 

This is what I found on PTS:

On standard tiles on Madis you get Bauxite, Coal, Hematite, and Quartz. I've heard from others that they got T2 on their scanned tiles, but I expect that this to be more rare (in ~50 scans I had none). Going further away from Alioth/Madis/Thades you get different distributions with higher tier ores more abundant, and T1 less so. I came across a moon where you had 300L/h default for Hematite, another 300L/h default for Coal.

 

Distribution and abundance will be significantly different from what we're used to. I suspect that is to promote trading across the system, especially with slow-boating (for pvp) as warping to the arse end of the system with a load of Hematite is going to be very expensive!

At least you can feel very strongly in which direction NQ wants to steer the players. However, I think that very few people will get involved. Nice idea, but it won't work.

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4 minutes ago, Zarcata said:

Nice idea, but it won't work.

I actually think it will, eventually. We first have a couple of weeks of tax free occupation, then another two weeks before tiles get abandoned. People will maximize their autominers, dip their feet to get them wet, see how it works, change stuff around, repeat. Eventually people will have lightbulb moments (a lot later then the rest) and we'll see people moving this or that way in exactly the way NQ is steering players with this change.

 

The question will be, will we have enough players left for it to matter by the time that happens? Dob we get enough newbies in that will spend their time mining T1? I expect a steady price rise of T1 ores and a decline of T2/T3 prices...

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On 11/19/2021 at 7:47 PM, Warlander said:

All ill gotten games when it was easy to amass mass weath with no limits compounded by the ability to scan mass amounts of tiles that will need to be wiped even though they said otherwise resulting in complete surpemacy of the server.

 

If you dont think that needs to happen at this point buckle up.

 

I am not sure i understand what you are trying to say . If for any reason you cannot properly speak and write it down for us thats not my concern . You can always get more education. And dont tell people to buckle up without a reason.

Friendly 

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6 hours ago, Ravenskysong said:

has anyone been on pts and seen what we will need to craft the mining units?

I made Screenshots form PTS, I uploaded them onto the Discord of Markee Dragon: https://discord.com/channels/103989522454298624/751748638476206161/911327679490453535

 

There are rumours that what was shown will not be what will be on Demter release. So you might not want to spend tons of quanta on it (yet). I've personally setup a factory line for 5x Uncommon Mining Unit L, I only need to slot in Schematics for the end product and the lines will start production rights away. Worst case scenario I have to change my manufacturing line a little bit, best case, this line can now make Advanced Mining Units L ?

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Questions:

You mentioned an ore pool difference between the inner and outer planets, as well as that the higher grade ores would be more likely to be found on the outer planets.

Will there also be general differences in the level of T1+2 ores between the planets in the safe zone or are the deposits there identical? (Madis-Thades-Alioth)
Will there be differences in the moons there, specifically T1+2 deposits.

Would you please also clarify again that the safe zones of the outer planets and moons will be abolished? Or will PvP content be moved to a new solar system and planets there?

Are the developers aware that with a funding amount you can also influence the players to settle permanently on other planets? Do the developers want us to settle on other planets at all or should planets/moons only be used for ore extraction by the MiningUnits?

 

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1 hour ago, Zarcata said:

Questions:

You mentioned an ore pool difference between the inner and outer planets, as well as that the higher grade ores would be more likely to be found on the outer planets.

Will there also be general differences in the level of T1+2 ores between the planets in the safe zone or are the deposits there identical? (Madis-Thades-Alioth)
Will there be differences in the moons there, specifically T1+2 deposits.

Would you please also clarify again that the safe zones of the outer planets and moons will be abolished? Or will PvP content be moved to a new solar system and planets there?

Are the developers aware that with a funding amount you can also influence the players to settle permanently on other planets? Do the developers want us to settle on other planets at all or should planets/moons only be used for ore extraction by the MiningUnits?

Please understand, this is what I found on PTS during the two test weekends:

On just about every tile I had scans for or scanned during the test on Alioth, Madis, Thades and Sanctuary had all four T1 ores, none of T2+, but I heard from others that some of their tiles did have T2+. So the assumption there is that it's rare. On Madis-Thades-Alioth each tile had 500-600 L/h total across the four T1 ores, each ore ranging from 5-450 L/h. Sanctuary had ~410 L/h across all four T1 ores. The moons other moons I looked at had only two T1 ores each, one being dominant (350-450 L/h) and a secondary T1 ore (50-100 L/h), per tile 450-500 L/h total.

 

One of the other planets I mentioned (not saying which one) had on each tile I had scanned the same T1 ore (5-50 l/h), the same T2 ore (110-225 L/h) and the same T3 ore (10-80 L/h), with an average of ~250 L/h average per tile. Other players hinted at some tiles having T4+ ores. On the moons of that planet I found that it had only one T1 ore, the same one on all tiles scanned (300 L/h). On another moon I found the same T2 ore on every tile (90-200 L/h), with the same T1 ore (110-240 L/h) with ~300 L/h total per tile.

 

Also keep in mind that Alioth has almost 260.000 tiles, it's moons (outside of sanctuary) another 29.000 tiles. Madis/Thades with their moons, another 83.000 tiles. The outer planets another almost 440.000 tiles. Over 800.000 tiles total. If every player wanted to auto mine with max skills and daily attendance, the current setup can support almost 25.000 accounts. But not everyone is going to mine with max skills or optimally, so way more then 25k players can be supported.

 

On PTS the safezones around the planets were intact, just the space between them is pvp space. Moving ore from one planet to the other can be safely done via warping, just imagine what the warpcell cost would be for 1.920.000 L Hematite... Slow-boating it between planets takes Time=Quanta and you risk pirates attacking you. Selling your T1 ore on outer planets when you have to cover your warpcell costs is not going to be profitable, especially when the competition is going to slow-boat it... BUT NQ has stated from the beginning (KS and Beta) that those safe zones will eventually be gone, I'm just not seeing that happening anytime soon.

 

I have no magic window into developer minds, I'm still working at pulling NQ personnel through Internet lines... ? But I suspect that from a game design perspective the chosen changes will not live in a vacuum, they'll have consequences. What those consequences will be might be very different from what they and we imagine they'll be. Partly because NQ might not have shared all plans, changes, partly because they can't accurately predict their players reactions ingame to those changes.

 

From my perspective, I see only Sanctuary as a truly persistent safe place for your resources. Any other place will eventually be either in a pvp zone (in a greater or lesser extent) or will be taxed (I doubt space stations will always be exempt, even if NQ currently assures us that they won't be taxed). I don't know if you're familiar with EVE, but everything there is pretty much a consumable. Your ships are just ammunition, you'll loose them eventually, so don't fly what you can't afford to loose. I see DU winding up there eventually, after many, many years of further development. That doesn't mean that until then we can't use/exploit those planets/moons. We can build a city there, I suspect that it'll be safe for years. And when that changes, I expect we'll have a warning way before hand and we would be able to pull back the resources we absolutely don't want to loose. But why worry about what might happen in years?

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6 hours ago, Cergorach said:

Please understand, this is what I found on PTS during the two test weekends:

On just about every tile I had scans for or scanned during the test on Alioth, Madis, Thades and Sanctuary had all four T1 ores, none of T2+, but I heard from others that some of their tiles did have T2+. So the assumption there is that it's rare. On Madis-Thades-Alioth each tile had 500-600 L/h total across the four T1 ores, each ore ranging from 5-450 L/h. Sanctuary had ~410 L/h across all four T1 ores. The moons other moons I looked at had only two T1 ores each, one being dominant (350-450 L/h) and a secondary T1 ore (50-100 L/h), per tile 450-500 L/h total.

 

One of the other planets I mentioned (not saying which one) had on each tile I had scanned the same T1 ore (5-50 l/h), the same T2 ore (110-225 L/h) and the same T3 ore (10-80 L/h), with an average of ~250 L/h average per tile. Other players hinted at some tiles having T4+ ores. On the moons of that planet I found that it had only one T1 ore, the same one on all tiles scanned (300 L/h). On another moon I found the same T2 ore on every tile (90-200 L/h), with the same T1 ore (110-240 L/h) with ~300 L/h total per tile.

 

 

 

Some good information here.

 

I'll add that we found T3 in the 200-250 L/H range, in hot spots (clusters of hexes).
And found T5 in the 30-50 L/H range, in hot spots.

We didn't find T4, but we didn't look very hard. So many scans, we just picked a couple of planets and looked through those, then mined out what we found to see how it worked.

 

 

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On 11/19/2021 at 3:16 PM, Zarcata said:

At least you can feel very strongly in which direction NQ wants to steer the players. However, I think that very few people will get involved. Nice idea, but it won't work.

 

The more NQ wants to force me into playing how they think I should play the more I refuse to be steered into it.

 

I cant think of a single MMO I have played out of the 100+ I have played since UQ that forced me to play or do something I didnt want to do or liked to do. Most devs realize that there is a gambit of playstyles to cover and each of them are just as important as the other.

 

I normally like to roll with top of the server PvP guilds but at the same time most of them are on a particular times so for the most part you solo during the day and get together at night and get something done as a guild/org.

 

In DU the more you do as a cew the laggier the gameplay is and the worse experience you have. I couldnt even mine half the time since I played if there was another person within 1.5km of me and it would jam up or slow down to the point it was unplayble.

 

This game really does not have any reason to group up unless you fill a specific role. Hellif they actually thought about making a group function that increased mining output, defense, damage, etc sure I might actually want to group with people to accomplish things but in reality there is no real need to.

 

Like I said I like rolling in large groups or in groups in general and this is the only game that I simply just dont need to because I make just as much ore more money solo than with other people around.

 

Im not trying to take over the game as much as play it to build a base, industry, and eventually get to PvP after my exp finally lets me do that. I purposely went mining, then piloting, then radar, then weapons, and finally ammo with a tiny bit of industry for honeycombs & QoL skills so I would have means to make money, get to actually want to get out and fight people to justify throwing away millions to hundreds of millions if things go sideways.

 

Im not asking for much more than just wanting to progress, build something to further that, a place to call home worth showing off, and enough left over to toss away in PvP if it ever really becomes a thing worth doing.

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2 hours ago, Underhook said:

Does anybody know ....... will bots be selling auto-miners when Demeter goes live.  I'm after T4 and T5, well I hope I am :)   After .23 I did what NQ wanted and I got out of industry.  I do hope they are not going to punish me for it now.

 

If we are luck they will put some up on the market but unless you park at a market for when the patch goes live people are going to buy them all up instantly like schamatics so that they can then turn around and get scanning while their org mates are busy scanning.

 

If we arent lucky we will have to buy the schematics and hope you have all the industry pre-reqs to instantly get producing the uato miners in whih you will be SoL until they have all their tiles set up since why help your competition mine when you need likely hundreds or thousands of miners per org and it will be a week until you see some up there while they gobble up all the tiles they can worth anything.

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59 minutes ago, Warlander said:

 

If we are luck they will put some up on the market but unless you park at a market for when the patch goes live people are going to buy them all up instantly like schamatics so that they can then turn around and get scanning while their org mates are busy scanning.

 

If we arent lucky we will have to buy the schematics and hope you have all the industry pre-reqs to instantly get producing the uato miners in whih you will be SoL until they have all their tiles set up since why help your competition mine when you need likely hundreds or thousands of miners per org and it will be a week until you see some up there while they gobble up all the tiles they can worth anything.

I have no industry skills, so if what your saying is correct there is no way I will be able to earn the money to pay the tax on tiles I claim whilst waiting for autominers to come onto the market.  I really hope NQ have actually put some thought and planning into this.  Fingers crossed. 

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19 minutes ago, Underhook said:

I have no industry skills, so if what your saying is correct there is no way I will be able to earn the money to pay the tax on tiles I claim whilst waiting for autominers to come onto the market.  I really hope NQ have actually put some thought and planning into this.  Fingers crossed. 

 

Yeah its either one or the other they put schematics or some mining units up on the market or they dont.

 

Yeah just depends on how many infustrialists are ready to hit the ground running or how many people pre-qued the mining talents for the reset once they talked about demeter will likely be how long it will take to get mining units out to the general public who were not ready for Demeter up front.

 

T4-5 mining units could take a week or two or 3/4 depending on how quickly scanner crews can identify the new juice tiles and drop miners down. SO if people drop units on the market before then they are empowering the ocmpeition and if they were smart they would starve the market out for those who do have good tiles to bleed millions per week sitting on them waiting for miners to enter the market.

 

To be safe I would at least account for a months worth of taxes with no ore coming in if that is what you are going for.

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9 hours ago, Underhook said:

Yep, I'm thinking I will get starved out.  I can probably pay the tax for a month, then I'm done.

 

Yeah just telling you what to look out for since if you go out and pick up a bunch of tiles hoping to get miners and they never get dropped in any suffient quantity to drop like 12 per tile to side step the efficiency drops its in people best interest to starve people out so that in like a month after people start running out of funds or you get bored of waiting for them they can then turn around and steal everything from you.

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13 minutes ago, Underhook said:

Day one of Demeter and zero mining units for sale.  WHAT.  How the hell are we supposed to pay tax with no income.

 

Yeah I was hoping they would have put some up in sufficent quantities even if whales bought them all up like schematics.

 

It looks like the market siege and subsiquent player sweep is under way. Guess we shall see in a week.

 

Its NQs way of telling you to kick rocks. I mean mine rocks. I mean harvest ground rocks. If you mine 15-30 of them you are getting more than the auto miners anyhow.

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