Demeter Territory cost of 500.000 quanta is to low!

[Verliezer]

A small calculation ..... assumption, you can sell T1 Ore for 90 quanta or more per ltr ore.

** initial one-off investment to buy a mining unit and a territory unit is not in calculation!

 

Upkeep cost of territory: 500.000 quanta's

-> (500.000 / 90) / 7 (days) / 24 (hrs) = 33 ltr/hr

A single territory (with no adjacent territories, nor talents) will be profitable from 34 ltr T1 ore ???

 

Based on this calculation I would say the upkeep costs are too low. Or did I miss something?

 

[sHuRuLuNi]

Wait, what?

[Snipey]

1 hour ago, Verliezer said:

A small calculation ..... assumption, you can sell T1 Ore for 90 quanta or more per ltr ore.

** initial one-off investment to buy a mining unit and a territory unit is not in calculation!

 

Upkeep cost of territory: 500.000 quanta's

-> (500.000 / 90) / 7 (days) / 24 (hrs) = 33 ltr/hr

A single territory (with no adjacent territories, nor talents) will be profitable from 34 ltr T1 ore ???

 

Based on this calculation I would say the upkeep costs are too low. Or did I miss something?

 

How much do you get paid to play this game? I sure as heck don't want it to be a job. Since the end goal is to have paying subs. I don't see a high tax beneficial to the games longevity.

 

Also you literally did your calculations based on your current knowledge of mining and its impacts within this economy.

Mining becoming a passive phase of the game essentially puts a speed limit on how much you can produce. HOWEVER since its steady all the time the market will slowly go back to PRE HYPER INFLATION prices like 35/l for t1
 

Economics is fun.

[Haunty]

I think it's more likely the tax will influence the ore price, not the other way around.

[RugesV]

The game is not collecting taxes to pay for a service.  IE NQ is not collecting taxes to build a roadway back to sole. The money is not needed, and is sent to oblivion when collected. 

 

So why does the game even have taxes? Clear out abandoned territories, Money sink, Prevent single entities from buying to much territory,  Keep players active in the game by needing to do things. 

 

The downside to taxes is people need to do things they dont want to (IE an artist might have to become a merchant, or mission runner to earn enough to pay for their territory). And it removes content from the game (remember DU is about player made content). 

 

A tax as low as 1 quanta a week solves the clear out abandoned territories, and keeps players active in the game by needing to do things.  Because taxes have a downside with them, Money sinks can be inserted in other aspects of the game.  That leaves the only reason to have any meaningful amount in taxes to prevent people from buying to much territory, And thats what the tax amount should be based on. Granted I think owning to much territory should be controlled by PVP, not just taxes. 

 

[CptLoRes]

But this is where I don't understand NQ's logic.

A flat time based tax will only hurt the small orgs and specialized solo players, and at the same time allow big orgs to cheaply acquire large amounts of tiles since they have the players needed to more easily cover the management overhead. So the change from the increasing tile prices to a flat tax, does the exact opposite of what you would think NQ wanted to achieve?

 

And once this plays out, it would not surprise me if we end up with having both an increasing one time cost and tax at the same time.

[Maxim Kammerer]

7 hours ago, CptLoRes said:

A flat time based tax will only hurt the small orgs and specialized solo players, and at the same time allow big orgs to cheaply acquire large amounts of tiles

DU was always advertised as a civilization building game and it seems NQ still has this agenda. They don't want solo players or small orgs. Large orgs get favoured and those who doesn't join them get punished.

[CptLoRes]

On 11/9/2021 at 8:59 AM, Maxim Kammerer said:

DU was always advertised as a civilization building game and it seems NQ still has this agenda. They don't want solo players or small orgs. Large orgs get favoured and those who doesn't join them get punished.

That a bit of a history rewrite I am afraid.

They wanted to give us the tools needed to build civilizations and large communities, but they where never against solo players.

 

From the original Kickstarter:

[removed image to free up space]

 

[Maxim Kammerer]

And you are still free to go your own way solo. It just gets harder and harder.

[Zarcata]

We can't build civilisations in the game, we don't have the tools for that. A better and clearer/customisable chat is missing, more options for the organisation menu are missing, especially ranks and rights, everything for various alliances to other organisations or sub-organisations is also missing. A sensible in-game calendar for events is missing. There is a general lack of an extended structure for large organisations so that it is not determined by just one player. More ranks and choices need to be created there.
Also missing is the possibility to build up a "faction" or a real civilisation. There is a lack of rights and possibilities to conquer a moon or planet and shape it peacefully with a peaceful civilisation. There is not even a meaningful friend-foe recognition. 
DualUniverse wants to offer something grandiose, that's why I'm here. At the moment I'm not even being served the starter, just brought the menu.

From the freedom what was marketed, every time with new patch and the changes a piece of freedom breaks away and more and more chains and rule sets are put on us.

Taxes are nonsensical in all forms. They turn the game into an obligation. When it comes to taking away from offline players, just tie ownership to an active sub and put a4 week grace period on it. If you don't come online then, everything is put in your inventory as BP or pushed onto Sanctuary, where you have your permanently exempt area.
What actually happens to Sanctuary when the moon is full? Is a new one simply placed next to it, should there really be such a rush of players?

 

[Maxim Kammerer]

2 hours ago, Zarcata said:

We can't build civilisations in the game, we don't have the tools for that.

That doesn't stop NQ from pushing us in this direction and nerfing solo gameplay is much easier than implementing the required tools..