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Up to date DAILY player count


LeeRoyINC

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I've seen a lot of people asking around lately about what the daily player count might be for DU. 

 

Luckily there's a website service that tracks all MMO's. 

 

https://mmo-population.com/r/dualuniverse#:~:text=How Many People Play Dual,total player base of 434%2C491.

 

As it sits it seems we've been steadily hovering around 4000 unique accounts per day for a few months now. It safe to say on average every daily player has at least 1 alt. (accounting for those who have 10) so the daily player count is between 2000 and 3000 being generous. 

 

The most at any one time was just under 40,000 and 431,000 accounts have been made since beta launch. 

 

With the games current state being a load more stable and detailed than at launch. It might be a good time for NQ to start another advertising push. Showcase the current games improvements since launch. 

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32 minutes ago, LeeRoyINC said:

With the games current state being a load more stable and detailed than at launch. It might be a good time for NQ to start another advertising push. Showcase the current games improvements since launch. 

In order to prevent a new wave of disappointment such an advertising push would need to be honest. That includes that the game must be advertised as what it currently is - an alpha version. But that will not happen.

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What is the point of presenting anything now? It's better to wait another 3-5 years and then have real PR when it's released. What would be more possible at the moment is another push of beta testers through beta key events or another fundraising event like the Kickstarter programme back then.
At the same time, it should always be pointed out that the game is still in alpha and a finished game can only be expected in a few years.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

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1 hour ago, LeeRoyINC said:

As it sits it seems we've been steadily hovering around 4000 unique accounts per day for a few months now. It safe to say on average every daily player has at least 1 alt. (accounting for those who have 10) so the daily player count is between 2000 and 3000 being generous. 

 

Likely "per capita" alts currently highter, because between people still playing -- most stubborn and invested-sunken-cost ones surivived better, people who have sometimes up to hundred alts in extream cases (not nessesary they loggin in all everyday, but still).

 

Personaly, I think we around 1000-1500 actual unique human log ins daily (many just for daily money) and 100-150 concurrent in terms of actual players, maybe 200-250 at week ends prime time or PvP event-battles.

 

Game is objectivly empty.

 

Not very scientific metric, but it shows almost zero global interest now:

https://twitchtracker.com/games/493826

 

 

 

 

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Personally, I don't take Twitch as an indication of success. As long as half-naked women sitting in a pool get hundreds of thousands of followers...it just shows how bored our society is and how it doesn't know what else to do.
DualUniverse cannot succeed via stream either, there is simply no interesting content. Ships fighting each other is a kind of browser game via periscope. It's just as exciting as the mission table in WoW at the garrison. What is missing here is a better and more direct way of playing that also allows proximity. Space battles tend to take place at a distance of 1-2 SU, proximity only arises because you have to fly in to loot. 
So, how to impress the followers? With hours of digging up ores? Or voxel the same assemblies over and over again? That lasts a few hours and is boring afterwards. No matter which DU streamer, they hardly have any active viewers any more.

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Yeah Twitch isn't the only metric for a successful game, but it is still an important metric.

 

Same with reddit, the community hasn't grown and there's rarely much activity or comments. Is it the only metric? No, but it isn't the Eve online era of 2003 -- presence on social media matters. You can't pretend that a game is successful when every online community about it is stagnant or shrinking.

 

I take mmo-population's numbers with a huge grain of salt (it does not measure actual players), but I do believe the general shape of the yearly population curve: a steady decline since open beta to the point where pop numbers now are not that different than closed beta. 

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True, but at the moment I think more PR would do more harm than good, since there are hardly any positive innovations worth mentioning in the game. At least they seem too small in relation to what has not (yet) been implemented to attract permanent players. So there urgently needs to be more content in the game.

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8 hours ago, Musclethorpe said:

Do you know how games get more players? They have good gameplay, not just promises of it.

Dual Universe is a building game and the question we should be asking is how do we make the building aspect of the game an element of gameplay when we couldn't even think of a way of doing that in concept, better yet implementation?

 

Minecraft has millions of players, it is a building game (with PVE survival mechanics in it), and technically it is not a game--building engine is the best way to describe it. With all the upgrades of Dual Universe, why haven't they migrated to this one yet if what they are looking for is a building engine? Have you already played Minecraft? The FPS in Minecraft is a lot faster, you can build and edit in that game a lot faster (meaning it is the more productive engine), and even if you build in Dual Universe without applying voxelmancy supposed you already have all the materials, it will take you a lot more time! Let me remind you that it is also buggy to build in this game so you take your time! (in Dual Universe, the vertices move and it is easy for you to completely f*ck up something if you are not building carefully! How about editing? The dynamic vertices make it hard for you to do that as well!) 

 

Minecraft is a lot superior to this engine despite all the upgrades of Dual Universe that makes it more extensive! People seem to opt for more simpler fundamentals that can be creatively scaled and can be produced faster!

 

How do we make the building an element of gameplay if you want to convert this into a game? Nobody has ever done this before!

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3 hours ago, Eternal said:

Dual Universe is a building game and the question we should be asking is how do we make the building aspect of the game an element of gameplay when we couldn't even think of a way of doing that in concept, better yet implementation?

 

Minecraft has millions of players, it is a building game (with PVE survival mechanics in it), and technically it is not a game--building engine is the best way to describe it. With all the upgrades of Dual Universe, why haven't they migrated to this one yet if what they are looking for is a building engine? Have you already played Minecraft? The FPS in Minecraft is a lot faster, you can build and edit in that game a lot faster (meaning it is the more productive engine), and even if you build in Dual Universe without applying voxelmancy supposed you already have all the materials, it will take you a lot more time! Let me remind you that it is also buggy to build in this game so you take your time! (in Dual Universe, the vertices move and it is easy for you to completely f*ck up something if you are not building carefully! How about editing? The dynamic vertices make it hard for you to do that as well!) 

 

Minecraft is a lot superior to this engine despite all the upgrades of Dual Universe that makes it more extensive! People seem to opt for more simpler fundamentals that can be creatively scaled and can be produced faster!

 

How do we make the building an element of gameplay if you want to convert this into a game? Nobody has ever done this before!

 

 

My nephew plays Minecraft on his parent's ipad.  I don't think DU will run on an ipad...

 

But when he's old enough, i'm sure he'll be tired of Minecraft, like i am, and looking for something new.

 

Personally i hope NQ sticks to their vision, because i think that's why Minecraft was so successful.

 

But if i wanted to play Minecraft, i would just play Minecraft.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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DU would probably be more successful with a similar model as MC: limited multiplayer and people can run their own servers if they want. 

  1. All the chatter about PvP or no would vanish because those rules could be server-specific -- that's like 50% of this forum at least lol
  2. People that want to play in creative mode to create art could (see above)
  3. NQ wouldn't have spent nearly a decade in alpha/beta because the complexity of an MMO was more than they could handle

With the game they wanted to design, an MMO never truly made sense -- it is far too niche (and incomplete) of a design with too inexperienced a team (especially at the leadership level). 

 

As has been said many (many) times, game design isn't NQ's strong point. Doing a sub-based MMO without strong game design is either hubris or vast incompetence. 

 

I mean...it's been 7+ years now, and there's still no good understanding of how PVP is supposed to really work. Territory war and avatar vs. avatar combat are basically just myths. 

 

Even with the changes and velocity in the last few months improving, I personally don't see NQ reaching enough subs to turn a profit and maintain that against churn. I don't think I can emphasize enough how important churn is and how little NQ has considered this in their design. 

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7 hours ago, ShippyLongstalking said:

DU would probably be more successful with a similar model as MC: limited multiplayer and people can run their own servers if they want.

 

I totally get your point. But

a) their tech is probably not made to run on a single server

b) there is already Empyrion. It is not that great in the building-part, but already has NPCs, etc.

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Anything fun for pve would be very welcome. The only stuff added in the last 12 months was economy fixing, bug fixing, pvp features. 
The economy fixing also made the game worse, plenty of smaller groups on the further away planets just quit when they could no longer play as a mostly autonomous org.
The "fun pve content" that some groups and people make, like racing, fly ins, competitions or exhibitions were all possible on day one of the beta and no new tools were added. Regarding fun things to do in the game, it went down, not up.

Yet at the same time I keep hearing some people, no idea what percentage of the player base that is, ask for even more pvp stuff, and all this "the game needs this and that pvp feature", "look at game X, imagine it without pvp" blah blah. 

I hope they finally punish people who use exploits, finally write down what is an exploit in a clear, reliably way; while also implementing some actually fun, engaging, mechanics, or change some current mechanics to be more than an afk grind. Increase the skill ceiling on some of the more interesting parts of the game. Get rid of the absurd situation where the most profitable activities are the most boring ones.

And speaking about twitch, the main reason why people watch DU streams is because many of the DU activities are so boring people want to have something extra on their second screen. And unlike in streams of games with more action, DU streamers always finds a moment to read the chat and work as second help desk for bugs and issues. 

Not sure why you hate on half naked streamers though.

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There is no use trying hard to get more players to join, before the game is in a stage that makes players not quit again..

Remember it is much harder to get someone to try again, once they have been put off the game. So aggressively pushing the game (releasing on steam etc). would only burn bridges at this stage.

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On 10/11/2021 at 9:51 AM, LeeRoyINC said:

I've seen a lot of people asking around lately about what the daily player count might be for DU. 

 

Luckily there's a website service that tracks all MMO's. 


That website is proven to be at best inaccurate and in reality grossly misleading.  We know the number of accounts at the start of Beta, as NQ removed that number from the website at that point. That number was last hovering around 45K I recall, We also know the concurrent player numbers during the first 2-3 weeks of beta which was peaking at around 3800 and then started to drop off. We know this because NQ left their API open so we had a live player counter for a while.

Based on that websites number for MMOs we have pretty accurate numbers for, EVE and Star Citizen, their numbers are at best extremely bloated and unreliable. I'd be surprised if DU currently has an active population of more than 400-500 players. At this time, the game's presence on Twitch is pretty much zero. Most big orgs have pretty much closed up shop and moved on, ODY being the last one to do so. 

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Last 7 days Youtube stats

Dual Universe: 19 hits

Starbase: 56 hits

 

Steam Charts 24h peak

Starbase: 762

 

Aproximate Dual Universe 24h peak = 762 *19 / 56 = 258

 

It is inacurrate for sure but it shows the general scale of things the number is probably a bit bigger as the Starbase game is new so some youtubers just shows it because of that. If I would have to guess then it's probably around 300

 

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The interesting thing is that NQ fixed most of the problems that I had with the game, which are:

- Stability problems (it was crashing constantly on my PC)

- Reason for PvP (Asteroids)

- Way to hold enemy in PvP (Warp blockade)

- New ways to earn Quanta (Mission runs)

It's still unbalanced as hell but atleast the features are there and I'm grateful for that.

 

However when I got back to Dual, it appeared that I don't have anyone to play with. Whole my Org (20-30 people) has left the servers long time ago and they laugh at the idea of comming back every time we talk about it. They left the game for Starbase and now as the Starbase died as well they all moved to New World. Maybe if all those changes would be magically introduced to the game a year ago when we were all still playing Dual Universe then they would never leave and now we would be happly fighting for asteroid domination with other orgs.

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1 hour ago, Zychov said:

However when I got back to Dual, it appeared that I don't have anyone to play with. Whole my Org (20-30 people) has left the servers long time ago and they laugh at the idea of comming back every time we talk about it. They left the game for Starbase and now as the Starbase died as well they all moved to New World. Maybe if all those changes would be magically introduced to the game a year ago when we were all still playing Dual Universe then they would never leave and now we would be happly fighting for asteroid domination with other orgs.

 

Yes, this globaly going to be the case of "too little, too late". Is extreamly hard for MMO to regenerate population once momentum is lost. Its probably just several exeptions in gaming history, if any. I think breaking point was november last year, when still a lot of people were hanging around in hopes of positive changes, but got only kick in balls by 0.23 and half of year of damning silence when JC gone.

 

This why full (almost full) wipe is imminent as last resort "defibrillator charge", even if some representitives of current token population deeply resentful to such prospect (for obvious reason of self-preservation).

 

SB mucked up in visualy similar manner, but with bit different internal workings.

 

NQ burned mostly on piles of lying (about actual state of game) and atrociously slow speeds of developing. FB is much more honest, technicaly capable and fast, but they done some gameplay priorities criminaly wrong, betting too much on wrong horses (that 99% run off). Both games released without viable sets of content, even for alpha/beta, its in common.

 

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