Jump to content

Empire Gets 1.2Bil stolen/insided by military leader


ELX987

Recommended Posts

9 hours ago, GraXXoR said:

Now add money to the equation with digital assets having increasingly real value (Bitcoin, Linden Dollars, DACs) and you start to incur “real” monetary damage.  So now,  you're at the point of causing actual financial hardship to someone on purpose, no matter how you look at it, and the associated ethics start coming into play.

Oh and just to adress this too: no, you don't incur "real" monetary damage and you dont cause any financial hardship whatsoever. 

1) youre stealing from an org bank and org assets. The personal isk/quanta aren't affected at all and ppl can still continue their sub without financial troubles in buying dacs/plex with ingame money

2) this "real" value is only because dacs/plex can be bought via rl money

BUT

You're not stealing actual money, just pixels

3) I don't have any personal gain (rl finances) from this. The org I stole from has no personal loss (rl finances). Reason being, RMT is illegal and you can't sell nor buy any ingame assets with rl money

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

I always find post like this interesting, those who condone and those who praise such actions.  As a member of the empire and also someone relatively new to the government/leadership in the Empire all I can really say is yep it was a hit but it has not destroyed anything except a trust and perhaps a friendship.  For him he is now someone known and it is less likely someone will trust him at all by far.  As for what assets got taken, it could have been a lot worse.  I was on as assets slowly got transferred but that as this is DU and you cannot do anything in the current mechanics with how you need to vote people out (which takes time).

 

Still I liked the guy especially trying to generate some PVP fun in a game sadly lacking this human interaction, civilization building, but equally I know how hard I mined to help improve things for the org so it was a hit to see time put in vanish.  Gutted I lost a few scanners and fuel I had stored in a hub.

 

Anyway this is all historic and past decisions by a previous leadership not the current one in existence as those players have long gone.   Things were turning in a far better direction and equally after this its gone 10 fold that way (except things are more restricted)  Still its not something I would do ever in an MMO as I respect people too much but I did hear it was the Eve way (glad I avoided that one).   I could personally have taken far more assets but hey that is not me and I'm pretty old school.

 

Good luck and hope it brings you whatever pleasure it does.  We are not dead, not fragmented, we will recover and of course any fund events we will take part in!

 

Honvik

Magister of the Empire

94602185_10158403430776979_1388705429516713984_n.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, Lethys said:

lol

 

it's a game dude. I stole trillions in eve too over the years, that doesn't mean i would do it IRL. also it doesn't mean i'm a shitty person IRL, because you guessed it, this is a friggin pixel game :D

Of course you are... a shitty person!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Lethys said:

 

You're not stealing actual money, just pixels

3) I don't have any personal gain (rl finances) from this. The org I stole from has no personal loss (rl finances). Reason being, RMT is illegal and you can't sell nor buy any ingame assets with rl money

you’re right. It’s an org bank so nobody suffered. 
 

next time you’re in an org, can you just hand me the contents of the org bank? Not your personal account, just the org. Because nobody suffers if it’s the org. 
 

means I will have fun so it’s a net gain for humanity.


 

but in the real world, I’ll remember this next time someone is ripping blu rays and putting them on Pirate Bay for free.


   Just pixels, check!!

   No financial gain, check!!
 

victimless shenanigans are the best shenanigans, right? Net gain. 
 

now I’m just getting pedantic again I’ll stop now. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

39 minutes ago, ErnstEllert said:

Of course you are... a shitty person!

Lmao

 

35 minutes ago, GraXXoR said:

you’re right. It’s an org bank so nobody suffered. 
 

next time you’re in an org, can you just hand me the contents of the org bank? Not your personal account, just the org. Because nobody suffers if it’s the org. 
 

means I will have fun so it’s a net gain for humanity.


 

but in the real world, I’ll remember this next time someone is ripping blu rays and putting them on Pirate Bay for free.


   Just pixels, check!!

   No financial gain, check!!
 

victimless shenanigans are the best shenanigans, right? Net gain. 
 

now I’m just getting pedantic again I’ll stop now. 

No, you have to work for it. If you then steal everything, noice. 

 

And again.....RL comparison. They lose rl money. An org in a pixelgame doesn't lose any rl money. Wrong analogy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Lethys said:

Yup. Which was illegal

why is selling a game character illegal? I have sold plenty of SC ships and made loads of coin...

could you site the law that forbids this, please.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, GraXXoR said:

why is selling a game character illegal? I have sold plenty of SC ships and made loads of coin...

could you site the law that forbids this, please.

Sure

https://community.eveonline.com/support/policies/eve-eula-en/

 

As he played eve. Up to the devs to decide that 

 

Edit

And also forbidden by NQ btw

https://www.dualuniverse.game/legal/eula

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was in charge of the factory at the time he stole that stuff and I'm honestly not sure how he stole from it, unless he took advantage of an RDMS bug or something. The first time there were only 4 Legates and then the second time only 3 including myself. He was not one of the legates and did not have access in any traditional manner. 

 

While out of game I support intrigue in games and have also done it before myself, we are in beta testing a game. With the theft from the largest player size group...how much testing are they now going to be able help contribute to testing. Are these materials being used by another group to test the game? Or did it all just become unused wealth.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/13/2021 at 2:13 AM, Honvik said:

 

I always find post like this interesting, those who condone and those who praise such actions.  As a member of the empire and also someone relatively new to the government/leadership in the Empire all I can really say is yep it was a hit but it has not destroyed anything except a trust and perhaps a friendship.  For him he is now someone known and it is less likely someone will trust him at all by far.  As for what assets got taken, it could have been a lot worse.  I was on as assets slowly got transferred but that as this is DU and you cannot do anything in the current mechanics with how you need to vote people out (which takes time).

 

Still I liked the guy especially trying to generate some PVP fun in a game sadly lacking this human interaction, civilization building, but equally I know how hard I mined to help improve things for the org so it was a hit to see time put in vanish.  Gutted I lost a few scanners and fuel I had stored in a hub.

 

Anyway this is all historic and past decisions by a previous leadership not the current one in existence as those players have long gone.   Things were turning in a far better direction and equally after this its gone 10 fold that way (except things are more restricted)  Still its not something I would do ever in an MMO as I respect people too much but I did hear it was the Eve way (glad I avoided that one).   I could personally have taken far more assets but hey that is not me and I'm pretty old school.

 

Good luck and hope it brings you whatever pleasure it does.  We are not dead, not fragmented, we will recover and of course any fund events we will take part in!

 

Honvik

Magister of the Empire

94602185_10158403430776979_1388705429516713984_n.jpg

OP here, glad to see a response from the robbed. Well said and classy, and i wish you best of luck, magister, on the battlefield!
 

-ELX987, BOO guy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/14/2021 at 6:39 AM, Lethys said:

Sure

https://community.eveonline.com/support/policies/eve-eula-en/

 

As he played eve. Up to the devs to decide that 

 

Edit

And also forbidden by NQ btw

https://www.dualuniverse.game/legal/eula

 

You said illegal, I’m asking about the law.
I don’t see any *actual law* forbidding it, just some terms and conditions. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, GraXXoR said:

You said illegal, I’m asking about the law.
I don’t see any *actual law* forbidding it, just some terms and conditions. 

well then do whatever you want in DU I guess because you mostly don't break any laws by your actions ingame. Resell quanta as much as you like then. Ill watch getting you banned xD

Link to comment
Share on other sites

40 minutes ago, Habitant said:

Personally i dont like that...

I was wondering CAN NQ do something about that ?

nope, its all part of the game, espionage is frowned apon but allowed as it should be

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh god, so there is a guy who is proud of stealing the work of people with whom he had a good relationship, where he was accepted and even liked ?
And he did not do this, because there were other people in another team, that he had an even better relationship with who now all gained advantage of the coup?

 

That saddens me, how lonely must be a person like this... Always destroying , what comes too near.

Well, i am not a psychologist, I just do not understand what this has to do with fun.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, Lethys said:

well then do whatever you want in DU I guess because you mostly don't break any laws by your actions ingame. Resell quanta as much as you like then. Ill watch getting you banned xD

Ah, so now you are also implying that I am going to get caught selling ℏ. And you are going to watch and laugh for some reason. 
 

Please, enlighten me, where did I say I would do that? Show me one single line.. quotes preferable to paraphrasing/making shit up. 

 

or you know, you could just do again what you did with the “illegal” nonsense and squirrel out of it without admitting you were wrong.


it’s almost as if you’re getting defensive about something. Not entirely sure what, tho. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, GraXXoR said:

Ah, so now you are also implying that I am going to get caught selling ℏ. And you are going to watch and laugh for some reason. 
 

Please, enlighten me, where did I say I would do that? Show me one single line.. quotes preferable to paraphrasing/making shit up. 

 

or you know, you could just do again what you did with the “illegal” nonsense and squirrel out of it without admitting you were wrong.


it’s almost as if you’re getting defensive about something. Not entirely sure what, tho. 

nope, never implied that.

 

Merely pointed out that considering the EULA it is not allowed to sell quanta - and if you do, you get banned. Hence why YOUR point or implication of "mimimi thieving incurs real money damage" is NOT valid. Yes I used the term "illegal" in a broad sense - so what. Semantics

 

so yes, dont really know what your point is because everything you say doesnt make any sense

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Lethys  refuting he said that he implied I am going to sell quanta in game...  and  get caught doing it...

7 hours ago, Lethys said:

nope, never implied that.

 

Merely pointed out that considering the EULA it is not allowed to sell quanta - and if you do, you get banned. Hence why YOUR point or implication of "mimimi thieving incurs real money damage" is NOT valid. Yes I used the term "illegal" in a broad sense - so what. Semantics

 

so yes, dont really know what your point is because everything you say doesnt make any sense

Lethys literally half a page up...

On 3/15/2021 at 4:17 PM, Lethys said:

Resell quanta as much as you like then. Ill watch getting you banned xD

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The main issue for me is that this theft isn't clever and can be done with complete impunity. 

 

They used the permissions the org gave them -- it wasn't "stealing", it was looting. 

 

If theft is supposed to be an interesting part of the game, it should have a real design.

 

Better feedback for the org to know when it is happening, skills or technique involved beyond just exploiting RDMS, and the ability for the org to actually respond.

 

Otherwise, all it does is encourage a dictator model of organizations because no one can be trusted -- new players never being able to be a part of leadership because they could be a danger instead of an asset.  

 

The fact that there's no recourse makes this more unimpressive -- no reputation system, no bounty system, no crime system, no ability to do anything other than restrict RDMS. 

 

I'm fine with theft being a part of this game, so long as it is a real concept, not some half-assed NQ implementation where one party can operate with impunity. That's not intrigue, it's trolling.

 

Until there's real systems in place to make theft interesting, org property shouldn't be so easy to pilfer. Theft/intrigue is supposed to have risk -- yes more PvP would help, but that's not the only thing required for theft to work as a game concept. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/15/2021 at 6:37 AM, GraXXoR said:

You said illegal, I’m asking about the law.
I don’t see any *actual law* forbidding it, just some terms and conditions. 

It was about this comment from you. If reselling quanta is ********just******* against some terms and conditions then you surely can resell quanta because it's not an *actual law* forbidding it.

 

And CLEARLY you wouldn't do it. Why? Because it gets you banned. So, it is illegal in du (again, semantics are fun!) To resell quanta. Because it gets you banned. Thus you cant earn money with it. As you implied. 

 

But hey, obviously you don't get it

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...