talents Mining efficiency +5% talent likely adds ZERO% per level

[Distinct Mint]

We know that the Mining Efficiency +5% ore extracted talent isn't working properly. Other threads have reported this, and NQ have said via twitter that they changed the talent. However they didn't say what they changed the talent to, even after persistent asking. Could it be +1% or +0.5% per talent level? It still says +5% in game, which is quite unfair to players who choose to train this, and who are unaware that it doesn't work.

 

In another thread in these forums, there were many wild ideas about what the talent did. So after rolling my eyes at this, @Billy_Boolaand I decided to do the obvious:

• Scan a hex and record the ore value. Call this S (in kilo-litres).
• Mine a known amount of ore. Call this m.
• Re-scan the hex and see how much ore remains. Call this s.
• Repeat until bored.

 

The data we recorded is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kIquhrbSAllViRFlCqtxtfS0SJCq76FWpgiyt1u6jr8/edit#gid=0

Yes we got bored fairly quickly. (Mining boring?!)

 

The talent as written says that

• (S-s)(1+xT) = m

where T is the talent level (0-5), and x is the (for the purposes of this experiment) unknown +x% level of ore added per talent level. 0.01=1%.

 

If the above is correct then we can estimate x via:

• x=(m/(S-s)-1)/T  for any talent level >0.

 

The data in the above spreadsheet does this for n=30 datapoints. The results are:

• Sample mean = -0.0011 (4 d.p.)
• Sample standard deviation = 0.0060
• 95% confidence interval for the true value of x = (-0.0033, 0.0012)

 

Conclusion: The Mining Efficiency talent most likely adds ZERO ore per talent level.

 

Notes:

• There is some noise (rounding) in the data as scans report ore in KL to 2 d.p. and only more when the ore amount is low. I'm too lazy to attempt to account for this.
• We have no idea if the territory scan amount accurately represents the amount in the hex
• I didn't attempt to see if there were any variations via planet, ore tier, player(!) or a different +x% amount per tier level.

[GraXXoR]

I’ve even asked for my 3 weeks of training time back. But they didn’t even respond. 
 

guess I have to write another bloody ticket. 

[Billy_Boola]

1 hour ago, GraXXoR said:

I’ve eel asked for my 3 weeks of training time back. But they didn’t even respond. 
 

guess I have to write another bloody ticket. 

yea. I asked heaps, in discord a couple of times, a lot on twitter, I think they want to pretend it's not a problem

[fiddlybits]

1 hour ago, Billy_Boola said:

yea. I asked heaps, in discord a couple of times, a lot on twitter, I think they want to pretend it's not a problem

On twitter didn't they say it was nerfed in an earlier patch?

[Bobbie]

.

[Physics]

9 hours ago, Distinct Mint said:

We know that the Mining Efficiency +5% ore extracted talent isn't working properly. Other threads have reported this, and NQ have said via twitter that they changed the talent. However they didn't say what they changed the talent to, even after persistent asking. Could it be +1% or +0.5% per talent level? It still says +5% in game, which is quite unfair to players who choose to train this, and who are unaware that it doesn't work.

 

In another thread in these forums, there were many wild ideas about what the talent did. So after rolling my eyes at this, @Billy_Boolaand I decided to do the obvious:

• Scan a hex and record the ore value. Call this S (in kilo-litres).
• Mine a known amount of ore. Call this m.
• Re-scan the hex and see how much ore remains. Call this s.
• Repeat until bored.

 

The data we recorded is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kIquhrbSAllViRFlCqtxtfS0SJCq76FWpgiyt1u6jr8/edit#gid=0

Yes we got bored fairly quickly. (Mining boring?!)

 

The talent as written says that

• (S-s)(1+xT) = m

where T is the talent level (0-5), and x is the (for the purposes of this experiment) unknown +x% level of ore added per talent level. 0.01=1%.

 

If the above is correct then we can estimate x via:

• x=(m/(S-s)-1)/T  for any talent level >0.

 

The data in the above spreadsheet does this for n=30 datapoints. The results are:

• Sample mean = -0.0011 (4 d.p.)
• Sample standard deviation = 0.0060
• 95% confidence interval for the true value of x = (-0.0033, 0.0012)

 

Conclusion: The Mining Efficiency talent most likely adds ZERO ore per talent level.

 

Notes:

• There is some noise (rounding) in the data as scans report ore in KL to 2 d.p. and only more when the ore amount is low. I'm too lazy to attempt to account for this.
• We have no idea if the territory scan amount accurately represents the amount in the hex
• I didn't attempt to see if there were any variations via planet, ore tier, player(!) or a different +x% amount per tier level.

Would it be worth testing with these methods using an avatar with 0 mining talents and comparing results?

[Fra119]

I was following the previous thread, my opinion was, and still is, that the one not working properly was the scanner, so as I was scanning on alioth a few days ago I did a couple of more tests in the meantime. The best one was over this one hex which had a small amount of malachite and limestone, like 5000 and 10000, ended up extracting like 5300 and 9500 (got the screenshot but I'm not at home atm), pretty much self-explanatory.

 

[Hazaatan]

4 hours ago, Fra119 said:

I was following the previous thread, my opinion was, and still is, that the one not working properly was the scanner, so as I was scanning on alioth a few days ago I did a couple of more tests in the meantime. The best one was over this one hex which had a small amount of malachite and limestone, like 5000 and 10000, ended up extracting like 5300 and 9500 (got the screenshot but I'm not at home atm), pretty much self-explanatory.

 

This is demoralizing.  So much frustration.  And the rumor is that they are working on PVP...  I predict that will only add more frustration, and probably cause another exodus... smh

[Billy_Boola]

5 hours ago, Physics said:

Would it be worth testing with these methods using an avatar with 0 mining talents and comparing results?

I did with an alt, it was removed as I only tested it once, but the results are the same.  A level 5 skill player gets the same bonus as a level 0 skill player

It is easy to reproduce this test, simply scan, go mine one type of ore, then re-scan afterwards. 


 

[Billy_Boola]

10 hours ago, fiddlybits said:

On twitter didn't they say it was nerfed in an earlier patch?

yes, but then they also said they were aware of it as a known issue, they keep contradicting themselves so you just can't believe anything the DU twitter account says.  I suspect it is different people monitoring the one twitter account and not knowing what they are talking about.  

[Billy_Boola]

4 hours ago, Fra119 said:

I was following the previous thread, my opinion was, and still is, that the one not working properly was the scanner, so as I was scanning on alioth a few days ago I did a couple of more tests in the meantime. The best one was over this one hex which had a small amount of malachite and limestone, like 5000 and 10000, ended up extracting like 5300 and 9500 (got the screenshot but I'm not at home atm), pretty much self-explanatory.

 

Interesting that you have one example of it working, not a very accurate example though, try it a few more times with actual rescaning and recording the results.

[DontPanic]

I can confirm that Dreger talents do not work for me,

but I don’t worry about that , the last talent reset will not have been a one-off thing.

I think there will be more resets.