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(Discussion) What do you feel is holding DU back?


Warlander

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Maybe but i do not see a company or a game the same as a person.

Typically if a person you love is/became a heroin addic with a drinking issue there would be a good reason to try to change their paterns.  i think this is the same with a company or game, if you dont want bancruptie or early withdrawal better to be open in communications

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5 hours ago, Eternal said:

Aerodynamics and flight is ridiculously hard in this game! You know, I have a better chance of designing an M1-size manned fixed-wing aircraft that is airworthy and works as intended in real-life than to design something in this game that works! I do the mechanical maintenance of m2 airline planes, my colleagues are pilots, I am telling you, we can't get a dynamic construct to work in this game! In the first place, I don't know how the game works because of the lack of information.

The 'aerodynamics' in DU aren't that hard, in fact they are much more forgiving then reality. But having RL experience with aerodynamics you have probably fallen in the same trap I did which is to expect RL behavior from the game. But DU 'aerodynamics' is nothing like RL, so you have to game the system instead of trying to make actual airworthy designs. It sucks I know, but it is was it is..

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14 hours ago, Aaron Cain said:

Well since nobody makes news anymore and since we cannot update the community page anymore and since we cannot post stories anymore the political landscape is kinda dead. 

Good observation, but reasons of swamp mostly in overall exaustion/attiration.

 

Core of organizations and playerbase formed as far as 2016 with literaly YEARS of "nothing to do" beyond forum-discord talks and much later -- some crude alpha experience (that was super-far from what many dreamed about backing game initialy). So active/ambitious/cringly (that good sometimes) people naturaly burned their energies to empiness of space, left or go sleeping. PvPers are struggling to find meaning. Sure, voxel fanatics or some sort of hermit-solo-industry-nerds suriving and even flourishing. But they generaly quite inert and "boring" players in terms of multiplayer politics and stuff making games like EVE fun. 

 

Still, this picture can be changed with several "active life" inspiring updates/features.

 

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5 minutes ago, le_souriceau said:

 

 

Still, this picture can be changed with several "active life" inspiring updates/features.

 

Ya, just drop all the safe zones of the outer planets, and you will see an instant spike in player base.  This is a VIDEO GAME, not "lets try to accumulate as much virtrual bullshit and horde it away simulator".  People want some excitement, and some space explosions, some politics, and some MEANING. 

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2 hours ago, JohnnyTazer said:

Actually they seem like the type of people who get in a relationship, then do whatever they can to change the person to fit whatever idealized version they think they should be, instead of loving them for who they actually are.

 

Then goes on to say

 

1 hour ago, JohnnyTazer said:

Ya, just drop all the safe zones of the outer planets, and you will see an instant spike in player base.  This is a VIDEO GAME, not "lets try to accumulate as much virtrual bullshit and horde it away simulator".  People want some excitement, and some space explosions, some politics, and some MEANING. 

 

Talk about pot and kettle.. damn..

 

 

Anyway, I think just giving the combat PVP crowd what they want is not going to have a lasting positive effect on the game's population at all. NQ needs to stick to their guns (yes, pun intended) and follow their vision for the game. The reasons why the safezones around planets are in place are clearly explained as is the condition for them to be removes. That reasoning, for once, make sense and NQ should stick to it.

 

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3 hours ago, JohnnyTazer said:

Ya, just drop all the safe zones of the outer planets, and you will see an instant spike in player base.  This is a VIDEO GAME, not "lets try to accumulate as much virtrual bullshit and horde it away simulator".  People want some excitement, and some space explosions, some politics, and some MEANING. 

I dont even think you need to drop it at this stage.  If they just randomised the warp entry points and or made the safe zone distance move over time it would make all the difference.  Currently you can just warp past everything, if there was just a chance that miners / traders would land outside safe zone (or have to take off outside) then it would bring security into the game.  All of a sudden you open up loads of additional gameplay paths for a far wider range of players.

I LOVE DU but I will still only recommend it to 20% of my friends in its current state because the others require the sort of jeopardy I am talking about to make the game entertaining.  People need to understand that it is not only pirate who want some risk in the game.

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9 hours ago, blazemonger said:

 

Then goes on to say

 

 

Talk about pot and kettle.. damn..

 

 

Anyway, I think just giving the combat PVP crowd what they want is not going to have a lasting positive effect on the game's population at all. NQ needs to stick to their guns (yes, pun intended) and follow their vision for the game. The reasons why the safezones around planets are in place are clearly explained as is the condition for them to be removes. That reasoning, for once, make sense and NQ should stick to it.

 

Its fitting you don't understand.  I backed this game because they said high tier ore would be in the pvp zone, and only small safe zones.  Im not advocating to "change" anything, but for them to keep/give us what was promised.  But then again, I dont expect much coming from you.

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I had seen this idea for restaurants but honestly I think it works for anyone who is building an experience. I'd like to see NQ sit down and make a post or a video about what does an hour or a day or even a week of gameplay look like to the average player. Be specific. How exactly in their finished product does NQ see the average player spending their time? Use that document to describe how all of these different features fit together. You could even make separate ones based on casual or hardcore play styles. 

 

That has been NQs biggest failing. They have not presented a plan to us, arguably their most important investors, about how the game is supposed to function end to end. Somehow we're getting a new solar system this year when 6 months ago we all thought that was a year or two after release. Have we contributed most of the development money? No. But the game, and NQ, live and die by the players. 

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2 minutes ago, Noddles said:

I had seen this idea for restaurants but honestly I think it works for anyone who is building an experience. I'd like to see NQ sit down and make a post or a video about what does an hour or a day or even a week of gameplay look like to the average player. Be specific. How exactly in their finished product does NQ see the average player spending their time? Use that document to describe how all of these different features fit together. You could even make separate ones based on casual or hardcore play styles. 

 

That has been NQs biggest failing. They have not presented a plan to us, arguably their most important investors, about how the game is supposed to function end to end. Somehow we're getting a new solar system this year when 6 months ago we all thought that was a year or two after release. Have we contributed most of the development money? No. But the game, and NQ, live and die by the players. 

Well, right now they'd be showing an awful lot of mining. They don't really have a cohesive game yet, and they're treating it like jenga. I'm sure that the .23 concept convo went something like this:

 

Devs: Players are making all their own stuff! The market will never take off!

JC: We've got to STOP THEM!

      *points to dev* You! Release the schematics!

Dev: But that will anger the pla...

JC: I DON'T CARE! They must be STOPPED!

Dev: Yes master...

        *drops .23r and 2/3 the subscribed player base quits*

JC: How DARE they? That patch was PERFECT! Perfect I tell you!

Devs: Well, now they say there's nothing to do but mine and solo play is dead....

JC: YES! That's the point!

Devs: They don't like that...

JC: I will do a "Q&A" on discord and tell them they should like it....

      *does discord Q&A*

Devs: They don't believe you... Some do, but many still don't... Unsubs are at record rates...

JC: At this rate, we're done for! Ok, ok, let me think... We'll tell them that the element destruction will be backtracked SOON(TM) and  we'll give them *air quotes* "something else" SOON(TM). Also, we'll lower the price on schematics, since they're griping about it....

      *posts video saying such*

NQ sits on backtrack patches to see what happens...

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3 hours ago, JohnnyTazer said:

Its fitting you don't understand.  I backed this game because they said high tier ore would be in the pvp zone, and only small safe zones.  Im not advocating to "change" anything, but for them to keep/give us what was promised.  But then again, I dont expect much coming from you.

The problem is space.

 

In the current format they have set a standard and if they shave it down now it just makes things worse since it is anything but a level playingfield at this point or any kind of balance to make it fun. If a new solar system is the answer then whenever the wipe happens they might as well add a 3rd connected opposing solar system and make the center one a no mans land pvp anywhere anytime but more stable in the two others with factions.

 

If they made the middle solar system so full of ore vs the standard homeworlds to the point that you could get rich overnight with 1 good haul or that there would be a sustained effort to get there to fight over the over abundant mats it would create the conditions to have a base for pvp  if you could also march into the opposing solar system minus Ailioth or the opposing version and the three moons as a triangulated protection if there are anti pvp generators protecting the safe zone triangle and the opposing side had to siege the generators and other things like in the empire strikes back for each of the moons. It also presents the idea that all ore tiers need to be semi present in those protected areas so that if they are pinned down in a blockade they can still mount a retaliation being cut off from the larger deposits on other planets but it needs to be respawnable and likely rock harvest bassed so it does not break the game.

 

At that point any expansion solar systems, just empty space or the belts of rock outside each solar system and dead planets could also be options or adding 1-2 enemy faction civs on wouldnt hurt either perhaps one being humans like us bound to the talent system and some kind of alien race on the other side. We just need random moments where a probe, scouting party, fleet, armada, mothership conflict shows up over time with invasion warnings like from skyforge.

 

Until that happens this game is not set up for pvp to happen or in any kind of scale that would make conducive large scale pvp if it was faction based and other smaller orgs could help out vs being smashed into the ground in every aspect of the game and never having any competition emerge since they already have and control most of the game already with the evolution of this game without more space to fight over with set jump gates and random wormholes, hot zones, gold rushes, and other features that draw people to certain areas.

 

Setting up a fish bowl and giving a kid a gun to blast gold fish trying to live their virtual lives to mine and prosper in a finite solar system is short sighted and will never achieve the type of PvP of EvE online they love so much. This game is just not set up for it to ever occur. I came here to smash faces and become a space pirate like everyone else and it turns out this is a forced labor camp sim with building elements and pvp ill never experience. Just feels like a bait and switch.

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5 hours ago, JohnnyTazer said:

I backed this game because they said high tier ore would be in the pvp zone, and only small safe zones.

 

If you back a game for it's location of higher tier ores.. well.. sure, that could be consideration I guess.. That said, it will be and we know this. Once Territory warfare comes in.

 

There's no argument from me that the permanent safe zone is bigger than initially intended. I can see arguments for both sides of this but am actually on the side that it is too big an area.. IMO Alioth and it's moons would have been enough. Overall though I do not think it impacts the game that much especially compared to other coming features not in the original plans.

 

I get that for many, the current state of combat PVP is not where they'd like it to be. At the same time I think a good number of players have entirely incorrectly set expectations for it and what it will eventually be like and/or what role it will play in the game overall.

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What is there to fight over?

 

  • Strip mined out moons/planets for the right to put down TUs to use our mining bots?
  • Liquidate comatose players massive reserves?
  • Gank cargo haulers?

Is that all we are really shooting for here?

 

Because if PvP were a thing the mega orgs would be brawling non stop with the massive stockpiles they have destroying their enemies before TWs come out long before now. But seeing as they have some mutual non combat pacts going now their power is only directed at people below them to keep that power and exploit the 100su gap between a solo player and the power of their orgs with no limits of any kind.

 

People wont typically fight unless they have a chance to win or it at least appears like they can even if they cant or that skill would somehow overcome the improbable / impossible odds. In DU you are pretty much facing orgs with free build mode potential and unlimited resources to destroy anything they come across. Those odds are so stacked against you that its likely that people will just live in safe zones and just bail on the rest of the content and just build since there is no means to do anything. Its a bad situation coming up and in no way does it help DU overall. The stakes are just way to high with no chance of success and everything to lose what will keep people playing? Most people are in comas already so do we pull the plug on their life support too while we are at it? There is no scenerio where this isnt a zero sum game that end any other way but badly for the studio the longer the PvP farce goes on.

 

If this were a PvP game you would think NQ would have common sense enough to add all 5 tiers of ore to each planet and having certain ores more plentiful than others so that orgs could at least contend with each other or that specfic planets were designed in their world generation for specific parts manufacturing with grades in mind to allow a guild to build what they need to control the planet and fight other planets at the very least but that probably never crossed their minds either.

 

You would think by now at the very least you could buy a tile territory or a region of territories and declare it a pvp zone by now so you could at least buy up a large enough pvp area to test what TWs would be like or have region scrims like some kind of battlefield size map but no I bet that shit didnt even cross their minds to allow for that.

 

Giving orgs monopolies on specific resources that are used in high end parts and grades is one thing but giving them the power to hold the technology and the whole market hostage is another.

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On 1/14/2021 at 4:13 AM, Eternal said:

Here are number of things that turns me off about this game which are reasons why I want to play the game less:

 

1.) the build mode editor can produce extensive results but through means of voxelmancy. With how voxels behave, it is just painful to build as you will get a lot of unexpected results and commonly are permanent even if you undo the action/s--these are painful to fix/redo. And since you will voxelmance everything which is very time-consuming, it is wise that you build your own voxel library to save your reusable shapes which you spend a lot of time creating for the purpose of reusability and saving time in your future projects.

 

...

 

8.) We have too many honeycombs in this game! Too many that it is not good! Look at their application? They are all applicable for everything which means they are just variety of textures! Make this less of a clutter! 

1. Interesting thing about building and voxelmancy, some of the BEST builders in the game - Thousand Stars, Poljack etc dont use voxelmancy really, they build with standard shapes.  Once you learn that it is actually pretty straight forward.  Poljack is currently completing our new large core space multipurpose.  It only took him a about two weeks of game time to complete.

2. There is nothing wrong with quanta injection, it is the start of the game and the economy, it NEEDS a huge injection of wealth.  EVER economy needs that to kick start it.  Whilst I agree the way of distribution isnt the best and I hope in the future it is updated, there is not any issue with it per se.  I will not argue that NQ have made other choices which have damaged the eco though.

3. Sorry but not every org is communist, infact far from it, there are a lot of org, including mine, who focus on helping people create independent career paths in game.  Everyone in our org is encourgage to own personal property, the ONLY communal property is supplied by me, the org leader for others to use.  I never ask org members to do something for nothing.

4. Just build a 4 l core hanger, which is a pretty large space.  It took two of us about two hours to clear the site completely ready for the build.  There are also other players you can hire to do the job for you if you dont enjoy it (CORE gameplay concept)

5. Not got a massive issue with the talents system but i would like to see a much more advanced starting position moving forward.  So new players are given the talent points at the start to focus on their chosen gameplay route

6. Feel free to come visit us and test fly some of our ships.  Making a viable ships which is very easy to control is pretty simple

7.  I am lucky to have built up a large amount of wealth in game, I stopped mining week 2 of headstart.  My best friend has made several hundreds of millions selling ships (he literally mined about 3 times in 6 months).  

 8. Agree with that, I would like to see set honeycombs as the item and colours as variety you can choose on deployment

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