Jump to content

What is the deal with voxel obstruction?


DenysS

Recommended Posts

I have just realized that there is no such a thing like voxel obstruction in the game - elements are obstructed only by other elements. So I can effectively just put everything I need for a ship into one big monolithic voxel cube and fly like a damn borg ship with same efficiency as players placed their stuff in adequate way... Will this stay like this?

 

Below is a completely functional ship from DU perspective and it flies perfectly fine... while being just a bunch of piloting elements bulged into one solid voxel cube

borg1.thumb.jpg.5187785df2ef4cdb7386974df93ddd0b.jpg 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Can you shoot through your own voxels?

 

 

this game is still effectively in early alpha, featurewise 

 

I suspect voxel occlusion will be introduced eventually.  I hope it figures into aerodynamics and also hit chance. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm not totally sure I want this fixed, one thing I'm really struggling with (aesthetically speaking) is dealing with airfoils, having wings on a fighter jet is ok, having them on a death star is not xD

The ability to hide stuff inside the ship surely helps

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, GraXXoR said:

Can you shoot through your own voxels?

Mh, I still haven't tried weapons, but i wonder if they actually "shoot" or if they just lock on a target and it magically explodes? I guess there is no bullet travelling from you to tour target, so technically you shoud be able to shoot through voxels unless they added obstruction like they did with other elements like engines/airfoils.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, GraXXoR said:

Can you shoot through your own voxels?

 

 

this game is still effectively in early alpha, featurewise 

 

I suspect voxel occlusion will be introduced eventually.  I hope it figures into aerodynamics and also hit chance. 

Yeah, I do not have a problem with it at current stage, but if it is not planned to be fixed later I see no point to keep ship building physics in this game at all beside aesthetic - as the most efficient ship will be just a bunch of elements smashed together somehow in a tiny place, and most effective pvp defense will be to cover whole core area in boxes. If it will stay like this - why keep all other ship mechanics at all? Just make a requirement of N elements per mass and if satisfied -  let it fly,  because currently it defacto works like that.

 

In combination with current simplification of center of mass to airfoil lift/stabilization - it looks really trashy, developers implemented complicated physics of atmo/space flying, buy allow us to fly in buckets with engines - makes no sense to me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's not that easy. If you want a truly well behaved ship you do need to keep at least one eye on the inertia matrix.

I am currently working on a VTOL ship that will translate from horizontal flight to vertical take off an landing (VTOL - sitting on its tail). And you have be very careful with placements to get something that behaves nicely in both modes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, CptLoRes said:

It's not that easy. If you want a truly well behaved ship you do need to keep at least one eye on the inertial matrix.

I am currently working on a VTOL ship that will translate from horizontal flight to vertical take off an landing (VTOL - sitting on its tail). And you have be very careful with placements to get something that behaves nicely in both modes.

After you finish it - you can just drag a voxel cube around it, just make it centered. 99% you won't feel any difference, but will be flying in borg ship instead. So what really matters is elements relative placing, you can then do whatever you want around them with voxels.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, ElGesem said:

After you finish it - you can just drag a voxel cube around it, just make it centered. 99% you won't feel any difference, but will be flying in borg ship instead. So what really matters is elements relative placing, you can then do whatever you want around them with voxels.

And this, folks, right here is still the case after 6 years in development.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For weapons at least, this does not appear to be the case; they need to be completely exposed and not at all encased in voxels in order to fire. We encountered an issue where even having the base of a railgun (not even the "gun" part) baked into voxels completely prevented it from firing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/4/2020 at 5:40 AM, ElGesem said:

I have just realized that there is no such a thing like voxel obstruction in the game - elements are obstructed only by other elements. So I can effectively just put everything I need for a ship into one big monolithic voxel cube and fly like a damn borg ship with same efficiency as players placed their stuff in adequate way... Will this stay like this?

 

Below is a completely functional ship from DU perspective and it flies perfectly fine... while being just a bunch of piloting elements bulged into one solid voxel cube

borg1.thumb.jpg.5187785df2ef4cdb7386974df93ddd0b.jpg 

Not actually true, voxels SHOULD effect element placing and they do show as effecting it within build mode, if you place voxels behind an engine etc it will turn red, which is supposed to show it has reduced output, if you look in your reports when flying the ship you will see that all the elements should have reduced effectiveness due to being blocked.  This mean that whilst you ship can function, its performance is greatly reduced.  How well this reduction is working in game I couldnt tell you, slightly surprised you didnt show us an image of your actually flight performance, rather than this image, which really doesnt show us much.

Trying to work out if this is a post based on actual evidence (that the output reduction is not working) or a knee jerk post from the new player.

 

red-engine.thumb.jpg.8c7f5aaf2d376bc6bec5180f93067646.jpg

Here is a test i did, see one engine is covered by voxels and is showing red

obstructed.thumb.jpg.3bc35917a6fa6307a09dac29d8dd8763.jpg

Here is the readout showing the element is 86% obstructed, which suggests that you conclusion that voxels do not effect element performance might be a little wide of the mark.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Moosegun said:

Here is the readout showing the element is 86% obstructed, which suggests that you conclusion that voxels do not effect element performance might be a little wide of the mark.

It says that it's obstructed, but have you done flight tests to confirm an actual degradation of performance?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/5/2020 at 11:04 AM, Moosegun said:

Not actually true, voxels SHOULD effect element placing and they do show as effecting it within build mode, if you place voxels behind an engine etc it will turn red, which is supposed to show it has reduced output, if you look in your reports when flying the ship you will see that all the elements should have reduced effectiveness due to being blocked.  This mean that whilst you ship can function, its performance is greatly reduced.  How well this reduction is working in game I couldnt tell you, slightly surprised you didnt show us an image of your actually flight performance, rather than this image, which really doesnt show us much.

Trying to work out if this is a post based on actual evidence (that the output reduction is not working) or a knee jerk post from the new player.

 

red-engine.thumb.jpg.8c7f5aaf2d376bc6bec5180f93067646.jpg

Here is a test i did, see one engine is covered by voxels and is showing red

obstructed.thumb.jpg.3bc35917a6fa6307a09dac29d8dd8763.jpg

Here is the readout showing the element is 86% obstructed, which suggests that you conclusion that voxels do not effect element performance might be a little wide of the mark.

I have no idea what did you do to block your engines with voxels. Specially for you I have made this sandbox with clearly visible voxels behind engines with no obstruction whatsoever 

https://ibb.co/yXLy39t
https://ibb.co/bLrJdwd

 

and as far as you did not test how it flies - here I have put cubes of shit behind engines of flying ship, and guess what? Nothing changed. No obstruction neither in report nor in flying. (just a small out of fuel case : D) 

https://ibb.co/T4rLFkg

 

basically same way you can go and wrap the whole ship in one big voxel cube - I just did not want to clean that after

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, ElGesem said:

I have no idea what did you do to block your engines with voxels. Specially for you I have made this sandbox with clearly visible voxels behind engines with no obstruction whatsoever 

https://ibb.co/yXLy39t
https://ibb.co/bLrJdwd

 

and as far as you did not test how it flies - here I have put cubes of shit behind engines of flying ship, and guess what? Nothing changed. No obstruction neither in report nor in flying. (just a small out of fuel case : D) 

https://ibb.co/T4rLFkg

 

basically same way you can go and wrap the whole ship in one big voxel cube - I just did not want to clean that after

Sadly your video is not very clear on the placement of your voxels and your images dont work, so difficult to see what you have actually done with the build.  It LOOKS like you have placed the voxels far enough away from the engines to not effect them.  In which case what you are really showing is an issue with the distance at which voxel effect engines, not that they DONT effect them.  Would be great to see a video with more voxel placement and position / testing and a bit less random flying around if possible.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Moosegun said:

Sadly your video is not very clear on the placement of your voxels and your images dont work, so difficult to see what you have actually done with the build.  It LOOKS like you have placed the voxels far enough away from the engines to not effect them.  In which case what you are really showing is an issue with the distance at which voxel effect engines, not that they DONT effect them.  Would be great to see a video with more voxel placement and position / testing and a bit less random flying around if possible.

I can not dance around your request and do screenshots in build all day. Images work perfectly fine for other people, as well as it is clearly visible on video that engines end inside voxels. If you want to believe voxels still block game elements it looks it is your choice and we can not do nothing with it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 7 months later...
On 10/7/2020 at 2:20 AM, ElGesem said:

I have no idea what did you do to block your engines with voxels. Specially for you I have made this sandbox with clearly visible voxels behind engines with no obstruction whatsoever 

https://ibb.co/yXLy39t
https://ibb.co/bLrJdwd

 

and as far as you did not test how it flies - here I have put cubes of shit behind engines of flying ship, and guess what? Nothing changed. No obstruction neither in report nor in flying. (just a small out of fuel case : D) 

https://ibb.co/T4rLFkg

 

basically same way you can go and wrap the whole ship in one big voxel cube - I just did not want to clean that after

Love the song :) 

 

Anyway, the whole obstructed thing is strangly weird. Wether or not it actually affects performance at this time.

Probably at some point it will.

 

My big problem is the fact that it is so inconsistant. 

Engines blink red on and off, showing 5% or 39% or nothing. While the ship is not doing anything. Nor am i changing anything.

So why would it go on and off with the message, and with different numbers? 

 

Giving me a headache.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/4/2020 at 5:40 AM, ElGesem said:

I have just realized that there is no such a thing like voxel obstruction in the game - elements are obstructed only by other elements. So I can effectively just put everything I need for a ship into one big monolithic voxel cube and fly like a damn borg ship with same efficiency as players placed their stuff in adequate way... Will this stay like this?

 

Below is a completely functional ship from DU perspective and it flies perfectly fine... while being just a bunch of piloting elements bulged into one solid voxel cube

borg1.thumb.jpg.5187785df2ef4cdb7386974df93ddd0b.jpg 

although this feature probably isn't intended, I gotta say it makes building wings much easier. the only time I don't like it is when engines are stuck in it and stuff.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...