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unown006

Should automated static defences be added to duel universe?

Should automated static defences be added to duel universe? a means to a log off deffense system  

91 members have voted

  1. 1. Should automated static defences be added to duel universe?

    • Yes they are needed to balance the game
      69
    • Yes but there more nice to have but not needed
      10
    • No this would make orgs op and citys unraidable
      5
    • No this wouldnt be good for the game in general
      7


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On 1/8/2019 at 11:53 PM, Sparktacus said:

Absolutely  agree there.

 

What I want to avoid is there being no cost or risk to attacking a ship.

 

An unarmed ship is basically a pinata, no risk to hitting it on the off chance something good falls out.

 

If there is some form of defense on the target, you need to weigh up whether the loot you get from attacking is worth the damage you get in return, however minimal. Sure, a dedicated combat ship vs a freighter, 1 on 1, you should still win, but youll take a few hits in return, and that will cost a bit to repair.

 

With that in mind, if there is no automated option, you have 2 choices

 

1 - fit a manned turret, and only ever fly when youve got a friend willing to sit in your ship waiting to use it on the offchance something happens

 

2 - go unarmed entirely, and accept youre a going to be a pinata for anyone who fancies it.

 

I really dont see it as likely that we'll have large groups of players flying around hunting down lone ships. I think its much more likely that we'll see lone players or small groups of 2 to 3 doing that, and thats what im talking about these defenses being for - not to win the fight, but to give the attackers some form of consequence for attacking so they at least have to consider if attacking a target is worth it.

 

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On 1/7/2019 at 8:18 AM, Lethys said:

Even with them, they don't (And shouldn't) stand a chance. First because balancing and second because one player!=100

Ah But this balancing isnt a huge problem as one these deffences can not move And the whole point of this is to create a way to defend your base so long as you put the time and reasorces to do so this way large groups do not have free will blowing up everything also this works bolth ways a large group can also fortify there base as well. Another note on balance when the NDA is lifted I can talk much more about how that can be implemented ;)

 

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On 1/8/2019 at 12:11 AM, Aaron Cain said:

I agree with @Lethys in this, a single person should not be able to resist the hordes of BOO or TU or DSI or any organization +100.

If you want to go solo then dig in deep or be mobile but remember if you just sit on the surface you might get blown to pieces. That is what organizations are for and that also means single person organizations or smaller ones will in the end have a hard struggle or need to organize into something bigger else they will also be shot to pieces, specially if the location they picked is on of interest. Combine that with the possible expensive Territory units it is almost impossible to easily run a one man org or something close to that.

 

 

And thats what this idea is suppose to help with I am not saying it should be easy Nor am I saying you can do this with little time put in but I am saying it should be possible to act as a deterrent for the big boys ;)

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On 1/14/2019 at 1:10 AM, Aaron Cain said:

Now about the auto guns, yess if possible would be nice but NQ already said it would be in but alot less effective then manually handeled guns. When the city is finished it will have a an automated defence grid made by Robotic Industries and other Friends and combined with Radar and Enmity lists it will be fun to see the first blacklisted player getting in range. i do hope it will be possible to add target systems to the Lua as i prefer to shoot at cores and cockpits leaving the rest unharmed.

BTW this post was made at the time when NQ strictly was not going to allow any auto deffences at all just somthing to keep in mind :)

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On 1/14/2019 at 3:10 AM, Serula said:

Man its hard to see if this topic is under NDA or not on mobile. A quick reply here. I expect single players to not be an interesting target cant say more because NDA. About the turrets it might be interesting to have them fire at a slow rate and maybe not so accurate when not manned.

Its under NDA sadly but I may make one in the NDA area to further discuss this.

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6 hours ago, unown006 said:

Ah But this balancing isnt a huge problem as one these deffences can not move And the whole point of this is to create a way to defend your base so long as you put the time and reasorces to do so this way large groups do not have free will blowing up everything also this works bolth ways a large group can also fortify there base as well. Another note on balance when the NDA is lifted I can talk much more about how that can be implemented ;)

 

Balancing IS a Problem - if a solo player gets strong defenses to secure his base then large orgs have them too. Which, in turn, make them even more invincible

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5 minutes ago, Lethys said:

Which, in turn, make them even more invincible

A few well-placed tactical orbital strikes* can destroy an "invincible" base. 😜

 

*I'm thinking something along the lines of a hypersonic space bomber dropping freefall bombs. So nothing "going against NQ's vision".

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41 minutes ago, 0something0 said:

A few well-placed tactical orbital strikes* can destroy an "invincible" base. 😜

 

*I'm thinking something along the lines of a hypersonic space bomber dropping freefall bombs. So nothing "going against NQ's vision".

would go well with orbital bombardment

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51 minutes ago, Lethys said:

Balancing IS a Problem - if a solo player gets strong defenses to secure his base then large orgs have them too. Which, in turn, make them even more invincible

Also by that logic nothing should be added due to more players = always better in a survival game

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1 hour ago, unown006 said:

Also by that logic nothing should be added due to more players = always better in a survival game

Not rly - that's why balancing is crucial 

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1 hour ago, unown006 said:

Also by that logic nothing should be added due to more players = always better in a survival game

And its no survival game and hopefully never will be.

i dont care to watch out for PvP and traps and stuff But i dont want to watch my hunger bar or my sleepiness. 

But if this is implemented i want gigantic space Squidds :D

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5 hours ago, Aaron Cain said:

And its no survival game and hopefully never will be.

i dont care to watch out for PvP and traps and stuff But i dont want to watch my hunger bar or my sleepiness. 

But if this is implemented i want gigantic space Squidds :D

Survival games are a subgenre of action video games set in a hostile, intense, open-world environment, where players generally begin with minimal equipment and are required to collect resources, craft tools, weapons, and shelter, and survive as long as possible. This sounds alot like DU atm theres just mmo also at play here but it doesnt change the fact that DU is a survival game.

 

6 hours ago, Lethys said:

Not rly - that's why balancing is crucial 

How would you balance them other then not having them?

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12 minutes ago, unown006 said:

Survival games are a subgenre of action video games set in a hostile, intense, open-world environment, where players generally begin with minimal equipment and are required to collect resources, craft tools, weapons, and shelter, and survive as long as possible. This sounds alot like DU atm theres just mmo also at play here but it doesnt change the fact that DU is a survival game.

DU have survival element/ aspect but that doesnt mean it is survival. You dont have to collect resource, craft tools , weapon  and shelter. for example i will join DU and work for a trucking org and control a spacecraft that org give me to deliver thing, do i have to collect resource for it - nah , do i have to build it  - nah, and like other thing.

 

And about survive , is it is everything goal ? to survive as long as it can as there is penalty for dying ? (drop all your inventory item ).

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44 minutes ago, ShioriStein said:

DU have survival element/ aspect but that doesnt mean it is survival. You dont have to collect resource, craft tools , weapon  and shelter. for example i will join DU and work for a trucking org and control a spacecraft that org give me to deliver thing, do i have to collect resource for it - nah , do i have to build it  - nah, and like other thing.

 

And about survive , is it is everything goal ? to survive as long as it can as there is penalty for dying ? (drop all your inventory item ).

I guess you are right there ;)

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14 hours ago, unown006 said:

How would you balance them other then not having them?

Exactly as they plan to do it: don't make them op, just so that a single (or two) ships won't stand a chance against a turret. The more auto turrets you get, the less effective they become. 

 

So they help against the drive by looter, won't have a chance against a true attack (man them to have one) and orgs can't abuse them

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51 minutes ago, Lethys said:

Exactly as they plan to do it: don't make them op, just so that a single (or two) ships won't stand a chance against a turret. The more auto turrets you get, the less effective they become. 

 

So they help against the drive by looter, won't have a chance against a true attack (man them to have one) and orgs can't abuse them

Problem There is to fight numbers you need numbers as then the large orgs will dominate dont believe me? Perhaps take a example of say Ark or rust or even eve online or SE or Coan exiles In each of these games Man power is true power each game reflects what DU will become if what you say comes to pass whether thats bad or good is up for Your interpretation.

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3 hours ago, unown006 said:

Problem There is to fight numbers you need numbers as then the large orgs will dominate dont believe me? Perhaps take a example of say Ark or rust or even eve online or SE or Coan exiles In each of these games Man power is true power each game reflects what DU will become if what you say comes to pass whether thats bad or good is up for Your interpretation.

Yes you need numbers.....So what? That's what an MMO is. Those who organise and help each other will be way more powerful than anyone else. 

If you op such a turret you have WAY more and other problems. 

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1 hour ago, Lethys said:

Yes you need numbers.....So what? That's what an MMO is. Those who organise and help each other will be way more powerful than anyone else. 

If you op such a turret you have WAY more and other problems. 

^^ That.

 

Auto defenses are there to serve 2 purposes for me

 

1) stop casual raiders blowing you up for a laugh.

 

2) Make things a bit more interesting for those who make the decision to come and make a concerted attack on you.

 

They shouldnt ever stop a co-ordinated team from taking your base when unmanned. They should make sure that theres a bit of a cost for doing so (repairing damage etc)

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4 hours ago, Lethys said:

Yes you need numbers.....So what? That's what an MMO is. Those who organise and help each other will be way more powerful than anyone else. 

If you op such a turret you have WAY more and other problems. 

Not just mmo"s and You misunderstand I am not stating or trying to Coney that automatic static deffences should be op What I am saying is if you put enough time and Reasorces and thought into building static deffences they should be able to hold off a sizeable force depending on what you made as otherwise you would be dominated as any large group could attack any player 10x smaller then them

 

 

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If it becomes the case that auto defences can hold against serious numerical advantage, then fights with close to balanced sides become massively weighted towards the defender.

 

If that happens, then the only viable attack tactic will be overwhelming numbers. That will exacerbate the "issue" with big orgs, as smaller orgs wont be able to muster enough force to take anything on, so the big orgs just wander around with impunity.

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55 minutes ago, Sparktacus said:

If it becomes the case that auto defences can hold against serious numerical advantage, then fights with close to balanced sides become massively weighted towards the defender.

 

If that happens, then the only viable attack tactic will be overwhelming numbers. That will exacerbate the "issue" with big orgs, as smaller orgs wont be able to muster enough force to take anything on, so the big orgs just wander around with impunity.

Or it becomes a deterrent for big orgs to attack seriously fortified small orgs or even solo players as they would lose to much for it to be worth it. Or simply a org isnt big enough and will have to develop better tech tactics ect to win. Honestly it can go either way but so far from what I have observed every group has a limit and every group can be destroyed.

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6 hours ago, unown006 said:

Not just mmo"s and You misunderstand I am not stating or trying to Coney that automatic static deffences should be op What I am saying is if you put enough time and Reasorces and thought into building static deffences they should be able to hold off a sizeable force depending on what you made as otherwise you would be dominated as any large group could attack any player 10x smaller then them

 

 

?

 

Large orgs can always destroy smaller ones. Regardless of defense. Whats "sizeable" to you in a game like DU?

 

Im with @Sparktacus on this one 

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1 minute ago, Lethys said:

?

 

Large orgs can always destroy smaller ones. Regardless of defense. Whats "sizeable" to you in a game like DU?

 

Im with @Sparktacus on this one 

I can see that

 

I am not sure what you do not understand can you be more specific than a '?' 

 

Not always as circumstance has alot to do with it

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8 minutes ago, unown006 said:

I can see that

 

I am not sure what you do not understand can you be more specific than a '?' 

 

Not always as circumstance has alot to do with it

Because I don't rly know what you mean by "sizeable force". As explained. 

 

Static defenses should only deter a random pirate or a very small gang at most (4-5 ships). Otherwise they're too op and will be abused by everyone, especially large orgs. There's no argument for large orgs not to spam them everywhere (no limit it might have, no resources such defenses might cost, no upkeep, no energy consumption,....)

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1 minute ago, Lethys said:

Because I don't rly know what you mean by "sizeable force". As explained. 

 

Static defenses should only deter a random pirate or a very small gang at most (4-5 ships). Otherwise they're too op and will be abused by everyone, especially large orgs. There's no argument for large orgs not to spam them everywhere (no limit it might have, no resources such defenses might cost, no upkeep, no energy consumption,....)

Who said they would not cost orgs anything nor require upkeep? And by sizable force I mean Also by sizable force I cant be specific because the mechanics are not currently introduced in the game. So you will have to inure what a sizable force would mean.

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