Jump to content
NQ-Nyzaltar

[DevBlog Feedback] Our thoughts on Territory Protection Mechanics

Recommended Posts

Thought the devs handled this conundrum fairly well and IMPROVED on the original sketched version too.

 

Yes for emerging infrastructure some protection bubbles. For very large civilization spaces a whole bigger grade of safe space on a bigger scale of protection facilities. In time no doubt... But let's encourage building first because the cooperation will be amazing to see.

 

And exploration and PvP can feel dangerous and very exciting and rewarding: High Risk: High Reward and lots of competition.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the Blog Novaquark, its always exciting when you put out new info.

 

So far I like the idea of the force-field unit having a cool down timer, and being indestructible for 24-48 hours, so nothing to add on that point.

 

My only suggestion would be to possibly add Discord as a notification. The reason being, that most Organizations are already using Discord as a means of communication, plus if you use Discord it would be easier to notify an entire group or Org in the event that a territory unit is compromised.

 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also here are some ideas for the name of the Force Field Unit:

 

Terrain Energy Shield

 

Spacial Protection Field

 

Agents of Shield

 

Force Field 2 Electric Boogaloo

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

sorry I'm bad with naming things

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Hades said:

Have you ever sent an email to your phone?  Wouldn’t it simply send you a text containing the plaintext of the email?  Seems sufficient to me.  Like I said, I’ve never had a use for it, but seems like there’s one here.  Why waste time creating an API when you can utilize the same e-mail service you plan on using for the rest of the population who is content with email notifications.

 

Looking into it, seems like I’m right.  Sends you a text message, which would just be dished out like a normal email.  If that’s not sufficient you deserve the base to fall haha.

 

It’s free of course, as long as you receive sms texts.

 

Edit:

Also, how hard is it to send NQ emails to your main inbox?  Easy as two clicks.

 

If NQ wants to create an API great.  If not, seems like an easy solution 

 

Anyway, seems off topic for this thread to begin with.

I 100% agree with @yamamushi Email is not perfect and people lose stuff all the time in their Spam folders. He's simply suggesting that an API would provide an additional, much, much less error prone, option for people to utilize in order to create apps and such to receive notifications on. Just because you think email "Seems sufficient to me" doesn't mean notifications like this wouldn't fit well into a DU API or that an API would be a bad thing. In addition, do you really have to insult Yama by saying he must have never sent email to his phone implying he doesn't know how to use email with his phone? Really? Simply the fact that something works does not mean it cannot be improved upon and expanded... The moment you start saying "It works, stop talking about other ways to do it" is the moment you start to squelch innovation and creativity. I for one don't want to see that become the general attitude around here towards people's ideas and I'm sure you don't either.

Just my 2cents

 

and thanks NQ for this awesome update :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, LittleJoe said:

I 100% agree with @yamamushi Email is not perfect and people lose stuff all the time in their Spam folders. He's simply suggesting that an API would provide an additional, much, much less error prone, option for people to utilize in order to create apps and such to receive notifications on. Just because you think email "Seems sufficient to me" doesn't mean notifications like this wouldn't fit well into a DU API or that an API would be a bad thing. In addition, do you really have to insult Yama by saying he must have never sent email to his phone implying he doesn't know how to use email with his phone? Really? Simply the fact that something works does not mean it cannot be improved upon and expanded... The moment you start saying "It works, stop talking about other ways to do it" is the moment you start to squelch innovation and creativity. I for one don't want to see that become the general attitude around here towards people's ideas and I'm sure you don't either.

Just my 2cents

 

and thanks NQ for this awesome update :)

I don’t think you got the gist at all.  Not sending an email to an email address.  Sending an email to a phone number.  Sending an email to a phone number sends a text, without needing some API that introduces vulnerabilities to botting, dosing, and other unforeseen issues.

 

I wasn’t insulting Yama at all, I was honestly curious.  I have never sent an email to a phone number, but recently I have researched it relatively extensively.  Sending an email to a phone number sends a plaintext sms message to the phone number.  That’s what I was curious with, I wasn’t sure how the email would be received on the recipients phone.  And I now know it is by sms text... after doing some research that I had not done when I made that comment.

 

Seeing that you made this error, it is clear you did not read my link at all.  I’d recommend perusing it.  There are no errors in this methodology.  You either get an email, or a text depending on whether you give NQ your email, or the carrier “email” that is your number + carrier domain.

 

I don’t think an API is necessary, and if you still want text alerts for a base going down, this is a way to get it.

 

Once again, I think this is off topic for this section.  I’d be more than happy to continue discussion in a private message if you’re so inclined.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, Hades said:

I don’t think you got the gist at all.  Not sending an email to an email address.  Sending an email to a phone number.  Sending an email to a phone number sends a text, without needing some API that introduces vulnerabilities to botting, dosing, and other unforeseen issues.

 

I wasn’t insulting Yama at all, I was honestly curious.  I have never sent an email to a phone number, but recently I have researched it relatively extensively.  Sending an email to a phone number sends a plaintext sms message to the phone number.  That’s what I was curious with, I wasn’t sure how the email would be received on the recipients phone.  And I now know it is by sms text... after doing some research that I had not done when I made that comment.

 

Seeing that you made this error, it is clear you did not read my link at all.  I’d recommend perusing it.  There are no errors in this methodology.  You either get an email, or a text depending on whether you give NQ your email, or the carrier “email” that is your number + carrier domain.

 

I don’t think an API is necessary, and if you still want text alerts for a base going down, this is a way to get it.

 

Once again, I think this is off topic for this section.  I’d be more than happy to continue discussion in a private message if you’re so inclined.

I apologize for missing the link, but my point about "going with what works" is still quite valid. I do with you that this is off topic, so I'll just end it here :)

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, yamamushi said:

 

- Particle Deflector Grid

That poses a good question... will these shields deflect?

 

If not, I’d be good with particle absorption grid.  The device itself being particle absorption unit?  Idk.  Having the device itself called a grid is pretty strange.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think the shielding should be automatically included with every structure it should be a costly and bulky additional unit to add to the structure so that small outposts hastily built and not invested in can be raided and destroyed by small pirate gangs in the normal areas. Purchase a small unit and only the core of the structure where you mount the defences and hide the storage get protection  while if you invest in a larger unit you might be able to protect the entire installation. 

Once your protection drops and you do manage to defend it till they come back up, rebuilding isn't a massive hassle since the blue print for the entire structure is saved you just click repair and it will rebuild if you have the materials to hand. 

This system is also great for mercenary groups, you can put out a request for mercs to come and defend your property, book them to come and sit on it for the duration of the protection drop.

How long the protection stays off shouldn't be too long, longer than 2 hours may be  bit too long for players without a large amount of time and may strong arm people into just sitting at home base for their entire play time. Space guard simulator isn't fun. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, yamamushi said:

Particle Deflector Grid

Eh, imo that leaves too much open to how the things will affect different types of weapons etc... also, deflectors may not be implemented, as it could cause server strain and would work weirdly with the lock and fire system.

 

I'd say 'Shield projection unit' or something along those lines might work better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Mafoon said:

I don't think the shielding should be automatically included with every structure it should be a costly and bulky additional unit to add to the structure so that small outposts hastily built and not invested in can be raided and destroyed by small pirate gangs in the normal areas

This has already been confirmed, shields will be very big and very expensive.

 

4 minutes ago, Mafoon said:

How long the protection stays off

Also, if the owner has resources to keep the shields up, why would they have to go down at all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Evil_Porcupine said:

Also, if the owner has resources to keep the shields up, why would they have to go down at all.

That actually sounds very cool, if the protection costs resource to run, you get notified how much you have stored when invading forces trigger it and how long that will last. If you can get more there you can just keeping topping it up. This could make for some really interesting game play with groups performing sieges to 'starve' out the protection of large bases while the owners try to war with the blockading forces to end the siege or line break vital resource through to hold out longer. 

 

If it worked this way it should be prevented from just switching it on and off to maximise it's run time. It should have a cool down period proportional to how long it was on. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good dev blog. 

It all sounds pretty standard in regards to attacking and defending. And I'm happy to hear there are more safe zones than just around the ark ship. That should help making a lot of players feel a bit more at ease. 

 

Now I'm not exactly the pvp type but I do get the impression that a real surprise attack seems of the table. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Make sure the safe zone on the starter planet is big enough for all the players! Otherwise it would get overcrowded fast.

I would like to suggest to make the whole starter planet a safe zone, not only the area around the arkship!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, Costanius said:

Make sure the safe zone on the starter planet is big enough for all the players! Otherwise it would get overcrowded fast.

I would like to suggest to make the whole starter planet a safe zone, not only the area around the arkship!

If there are only low value resources in the ground then why not. But ppl most likely won't be able to Go to space with those so you'd need some UA too where rare ores can be found. 

Thus all of alioth ist a Bad idea but a quarter or half of it - why not

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, Costanius said:

Make sure the safe zone on the starter planet is big enough for all the players! Otherwise it would get overcrowded fast.

I would like to suggest to make the whole starter planet a safe zone, not only the area around the arkship!

From what i hear, it is 20 x 20 Km mean a lot of title to claim ,( 20 x 20 right ?)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, ShioriStein said:

From what i hear, it is 20 x 20 Km mean a lot of title to claim ,( 20 x 20 right ?)

20km Radius, but that Info is old. So maybe they change it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh yes so i remember wrong, it is 20km radius . Hmm they may change but 20km radius still quite big isnt it ? , 100+ title  and each tile bigger than 1Km2 so it will be huge enough to fit 10000 player at start.

Wonder will they decrease or increase it since i thing 100+ Km2 is more than enough but well have to wait to see more information

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I completely agree with Novaquark's goal of finding a moderate way between either extreme.  I have seen that as their attitude from the beginning and it is one of the main things that convinced me to back this project.

 

I like their plan for the three types of areas.  Having only one secure area around the Arkship, even though it really would be rather large, seemed restrictive.  It felt like it was just an introduction area and the real game started outside of.  Introducing the MSA eliminates that feeling.

 

The first time I read it, I missed one of the differences between ASA and MSA.  Nothing is allowed in the MSA until the territory is claimed.  This will prevent people from wandering in and doing random mining and terraforming, which make these areas more attractive.

 

I am very interested in finding out what the differences between Normal Territory Units and Sanctuary Territory Units will be.  I also wonder how the demand for Guarded Territories and Sanctuary Territories will be handled.  Since they serve different purposes, I think they should be handled differently.  

 

Those in the ASA will be the first things new players see, so I expect the demand for them to be very high, with those closer to the Arkship being considered more valuable.  It would make sense to have periodic auctions for the Guarded Territories.  This means someone could lose the territory they had if they were outbid, but it could increase the chances of these prime locations being used in a way that benefits the community.

 

I expect the MSA will be effectively unlimited, with new areas introduced as the old ones fill up, so everyone who wants one will be able to claim it.  They do not have even the limited resources the ASA does and  their location would only matter aesthetically.  I do not think there is the same need to compete for Santuary Territories.  Once someone claims one, they should be able to keep it as long as they want without being afraid they might lose it.  The only exception would be the claim should expire if the owner has not logged in for several months.

 

Several people have expressed concerns about secure areas being used as staging areas for attacks.  My suggestion for solving that would be to make any weapons that were in a secure area inoperable for some time after they leave it.  The length of time would depend on the number of weapons in one territory.  If there were few weapons, the delay would only be a second or two.  As the number of weapons increased, the delay would extend to several minutes and then several hours.  The delay have almost no effect on someone who carried a couple weapons for protection, but it would make storing an invasion fleet impractical, since it would need wait that time defenseless in a normal area before it could be used.  The explanation for the delay would the technology that inhibits the use of weapons in a secure area becomes overloaded if too many are concentrated in one territory.  When it is overloaded, it can not keep up with removing the inhibition when the weapons leave the area.

 

Finally, I have a couple questions about the protection bubbles.

  • It says protection bubbles are activated for 24-48 hours.  Does that mean it will be a random time within that range, that the owner can chose the time within that range or the developers still need to pick a time in that range?
  • If attack notifications are sent, would they only go to the owner of a territory or  to everyone in it?  For example, it there was a trader visiting the territory, would they be notified so they could flee before the attack or would it be up to the territory owner to do that if they chose?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Ben Fargo said:

This means someone could lose the territory they had if they were outbid, but it could increase the chances of these prime locations being used in a way that benefits the community.

Or some rich troll just buys what He wants to troll others. If ppl built their monuments there it would be unfair and just Bad griefers f someone could simply outbid you and destroy the Monument (as He gets access to rdms->mine it).

 

9 minutes ago, Ben Fargo said:

Once someone claims one, they should be able to keep it as long as they want without being afraid they might lose it.  The only exception would be the claim should expire if the owner has not logged in for several months.

 

Several people have expressed concerns about secure areas being used as staging areas for attacks.  My suggestion for solving that would be to make any weapons that were in a secure area inoperable for some time after they leave it.  The length of time would depend on the number of weapons in one territory.  If there were few weapons, the delay would only be a second or two.  As the number of weapons increased, the delay would extend to several minutes and then several hours.  The delay have almost no effect on someone who carried a couple weapons for protection, but it would make storing an invasion fleet impractical, since it would need wait that time defenseless in a normal area before it could be used.  The explanation for the delay would the technology that inhibits the use of weapons in a secure area becomes overloaded if too many are concentrated in one territory.  When it is overloaded, it can not keep up with removing the inhibition when the weapons leave the area.

Just put down 5 or 20 sanctuaries, spread your fleet equally and you can always bypass that too. Store loot there indefinitely, come back days or weeks later and transport everything to your main base. 

Still abuseable

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Costanius said:

Make sure the safe zone on the starter planet is big enough for all the players! Otherwise it would get overcrowded fast.

I would like to suggest to make the whole starter planet a safe zone, not only the area around the arkship!

2 hours ago, Lethys said:

If there are only low value resources in the ground then why not. But ppl most likely won't be able to Go to space with those so you'd need some UA too where rare ores can be found. 

Thus all of alioth ist a Bad idea but a quarter or half of it - why not

This is becoming very interesting.

 

I wonder...

 

I think a large area for the starter zone will be a good idea eg half of the whole planet and maybe even more of Alioth's system. But then I'm wondering how that may integrate with as Lethys says, ore value and what sort of rights players will have on terraforming the hexes and how that will drive who claims what and for what purpose in this starter planet?

 

I could imagine all of Alioth is non-degradable (no terraforming) as well as no pvp: It's symmetrical to the intended system and of course the exception that proves the rule between pvp and builders. Then and again such a non-interactive place might feel lifeless. The fate of Alioth is truly already in humanity's hands !

 

Idk, picture this:-

 

The Ark Ship Day 1: Ship surrounded by virgin wilderness

 

The Ark Ship Day 1,000: Either huge metropolis or giant garbage despoilment

 

I'm too excited (and hence confused) to think further on this at this time, thinking of the possible future strands that holds the fate of Alioth's destiny in it's hands!

 

Hmm, maybe half the planet safezone and half as Lethys says... that's beginning to sound good and in natural progression too.

 

ps: Annoyingly I've used up all my permissible "actions" today so cannot like posts, but I like these posts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

UADD Unsecure Area Deflector Dish or NTDD Normal Territory Deflector Doohickey

 

Maybe a separate thread would make more sense for these suggestions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, MookMcMook said:

 

I could imagine all of Alioth is non-degradable (no terraforming) as well as no pvp: It's symmetrical to the intended system and of course the exception that proves the rule between pvp and builders. Then and again such a non-interactive place might feel lifeless. The fate of Alioth is truly already in humanity's hands !

As i said that could work too If NQ ever runs Out of safe spaces. But then they should Stick to their narrative of "only low value resources in the ground". 

People have enough space to build but they still NEED to Go outside (or buy from someone who went outside).

Remember ASA is mineable, so that would work too. 

 

To me it would definitely be lifeless as there will be no change in such a place but then again I won't ever be there and see it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Kurock said:

UADD Unsecure Area Deflector Dish or NTDD Normal Territory Deflector Doohickey

 

Maybe a separate thread would make more sense for these suggestions.

timey wimey safey placey?

 

2 minutes ago, Lethys said:

"only low value resources in the ground". 

This would be my issue if they expanded the ASA to much past maybe another few Km. We wouldn't be able to get off the planet without the rarer materials and the market would never take off.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...