Omfgreenhair Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 On 3-1-2018 at 2:05 PM, ShioriStein said: Why dont we, de new Human of the new world create those event ? Like a big ship crash into the planetary trade center in the capital of Empire Alioth. Like that we dont need AI, we should create event ourself. I can see an organisation revolve around building dungeons or Ninja Warrior esque arenas to provide us with some bread and circus. It's wouldn't be too far fetched to have a teritory unit (to distribute rights), know your game mechanics and be profficient in level design to achieve something you can do on a monthly basis. > Imagine hosting monthly competitions between large factions who send in their five-man elite team to survive your fresh dungeon. > Imagine, when it gets populair, to have to fend off corporate espionage of corps who want to have an edge in the comming competition. > Imagine the absolute motherloads of ingame credits it could generate with stage tickets > Imagine hosting a stream on Twitch every month covering these competitions. > Imagine the fame players get for participating. > Imagine the ingame business contracts corps could get for winning the competitions. I see no downside to providing your fellow players with a corner stone of our new online society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethys Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 3 minutes ago, Takao said: I wouldn't call PvE boring all the time. It's not boring when you have a challenge. Because programming an AI that makes fighting it a challenge is really difficult, most of the time that challenge comes from the numbers of enemies or their healthbar -.- I don't think that DU can be successfull without any PvE, because where do you wan't to get all the recources for your ships that get destroyed because of PvP? Mining? That would be a grind. As you said: more numbers or higher health bar is just stupid and boring. So the only thing to make pve a little bit more interesting ist a good ai. Which needs dev time. And I don't think that they have the time for that, considering the scope of Du. And even with a good AI, pve is just grinding and boring to me. After you get the hang of it, it's always the same. Rinse and repeate. I'd rather have player interaction which I can't predict that easily Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anaximander Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 35 minutes ago, Takao said: I wouldn't call PvE boring all the time. It's not boring when you have a challenge. Because programming an AI that makes fighting it a challenge is really difficult, most of the time that challenge comes from the numbers of enemies or their healthbar -.- I don't think that DU can be successfull without any PvE, because where do you wan't to get all the recources for your ships that get destroyed because of PvP? Mining? That would be a grind. That's the plan though. Deal with it. Also, since you have zero clue of this - and its obvious - AI needs its own server (since NPCs are client instances operated by the server). Tell me, how much will the AWS hosting costs skyrocket for NQ, if they were to add PVE, with scripts and how much would it ruin their developement crunch if they were to add pointless PVE, cause YOU are lazy and don't want to mine? DU is not a theme park, they never advertised as a Theme Park. It's a Sandbox. They never said the will add - or want - PVE with dungeons and loot bags. Plus, DU if it had PVE, it would be like EVE - people showing up when "epic snowflakes" do a high end boss, murder the snowflakes, kill the boss, get the loot and post the kill mail humiliating the Carebears for being dumb. The only PVE they should add ,is for hunting and skinning for making cool clothes and stuff. Link PVE with the actual economy, and making PVE a profession, not "kill 100000000000 wolves so the Space Princess can give you the Sword of Carebearius". You want PVE to get materials for your ship? Might as well tell them "make wolves drop money". That's the level of disconnect you have with economics. MookMcMook, Hotwingz, Ben Fargo and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eternal Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Also, pls do not forget that one of the main selling-point of this game is "player-driven-socialization" (Not just player-driven-PVP) in a single-shard-server. I hope that the resources that we are gonna farm here are not only for PVP-use, but for socialization as well. We don't have PVE in this game, I can accept that! But if farming resources are all for PVP-use, no! It becomes a part of PVP then. Add Socialization-use to the farming. So farming is for Socialization and PVP. Farming is not PVE, because there is no PVE in this game when it is all player-driven (PVE is a mechanics that is game-driven, which is impossible for us to have. Role-playing is part of Socialization). We cannot technically have PVE(due to the game-design), but we can have 2 aspects to this game; PVP and Socialization, both player-driven. And if we can make wealth in this game, don't tell me that the end-game is only PVP! Make Socialization an aspect of wealth-spending. That's why I ask for vanity-items like player-made-Socialization-Constructs. Otherwise, the end-game is all PVP(that means being elite-rich means you have a lot of assets for PVP-disposal. There should be a real-estate, bribery for social-privilege, social-ladder, social-status, to it, you know, a luxury for the rich. In that case, greed is not only limited to obsession of power, but can also be associated with obsession of social-status (2 parts of the game - PVP and Socialization). We work in real-life to survive(needs), we don't have survival-mechanics in this game, but also for (want, things that we do not necessarily need). With no survival-mechanics, "want" is the only driving-factor to wealth-acquisition that is not PVP. That's why we need some kind of a social-ladder associated to wealth-acquisition (like player-driven-Forbes-magazine to boost your ego). Some people will work in this game as a Board-Member like Chairman(owner/s of a company) and run their business as usual so they may one-day in this game end-up like the Chinese-Billionaires you see in Southeast Asia. They will have their own culture because of status-difference. If you are not greedy, you can play the game however you want(leave the greed to the elites). But like I said, there are 2 sides to greed relating to PVP and Socialization. Sadly, game needs to have a purpose for it to work. If you take out survival in real-life, what will be the driving-factor for you to acquire wealth? Fantasy, Supermega and Anaximander 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethys Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Maybe that's just me but in my little world socializing (the way you described it) is PvP.... - greed: don't mess with me as i own the markets - Economy itself - "best", "top", "richest", "biggest" org or the Most influencial one - real estate - bribery -... All that boils down to "I'm better than you and I won the 1v1" Will the endgame be all about PvP in the common sense (destruction)? No, ofc not. That entirely depends on players and what they do with it. If they let some moron rule the starter system who just wants to grief ppl then that's the players fault. People will do all kinds of stuff - just look at Eve. Most alliances took space in Null and kill anyone who enters. But there is Providence too where they let everyone in when they behave properly. That will happen in DU too, with way more social gameplay involved as in eve. Players just need to do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eternal Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Yes, indeed, it's still PVP, but in a non-physical-combat-manner. I still like it. It works for me, and the system is all fair. I just do not want it to be limited to combat, that's all I'm saying. PVP in terms of Socialization (this is what drives me more, not the combat). Lethys, Supermega and Fantasy 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronael Posted January 6, 2018 Author Share Posted January 6, 2018 Except that most people who think to destroy or only pvp, without generalizing, are people without work "no-life". So they always have a head start and can build that. Supermega 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anaximander Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 1 hour ago, Cronael said: Except that most people who think to destroy or only pvp, without generalizing, are people without work "no-life". So they always have a head start and can build that. DU is a game designed in the fashion of EVE Online. Your "grind" doesn't get you anywhere. Connections do. I know a lot of no lifers as you say in EVE who are nobodies, and people who play twice a week who own the markets. Also, get in an organisation, like the French community which is part of the Band of Outlaws. That's the point of playing an MMO, it's to play with other people, not grinding alone. There are mining corporations, industry, militaries and militias (different things FYI), all of which have a place and a role you can fulfull in them. Grinding NPCs is a stupid passtime, in a game where you can be a LEGIT law enforcement officer and chasing scammers off of your territory's marketplace - cause NovaQuark won't do it for you, you are meant to keep your markets safe, in any way, shape or form. If your problem is for WORKING your way to the top, there's piracy. But hey, you are not so "tough" if the enemy is a person who can outsmart you, right? MookMcMook 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronael Posted January 6, 2018 Author Share Posted January 6, 2018 54 minutes ago, CaptainTwerkmotor said: DU is a game designed in the fashion of EVE Online. Your "grind" doesn't get you anywhere. Connections do. I know a lot of no lifers as you say in EVE who are nobodies, and people who play twice a week who own the markets. Also, get in an organisation, like the French community which is part of the Band of Outlaws. That's the point of playing an MMO, it's to play with other people, not grinding alone. There are mining corporations, industry, militaries and militias (different things FYI), all of which have a place and a role you can fulfull in them. Grinding NPCs is a stupid passtime, in a game where you can be a LEGIT law enforcement officer and chasing scammers off of your territory's marketplace - cause NovaQuark won't do it for you, you are meant to keep your markets safe, in any way, shape or form. If your problem is for WORKING your way to the top, there's piracy. But hey, you are not so "tough" if the enemy is a person who can outsmart you, right? I agree. We have to wait to see how these categories will be proportional with the number of players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MookMcMook Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 3 hours ago, Takao said: I wouldn't call PvE boring all the time. It's not boring when you have a challenge. Because programming an AI that makes fighting it a challenge is really difficult, most of the time that challenge comes from the numbers of enemies or their healthbar -.- I don't think that DU can be successfull without any PvE, because where do you wan't to get all the recources for your ships that get destroyed because of PvP? Mining? That would be a grind. This is an immensely helpful comment to clarify what perhaps the OP is asking for, or to define it more strictly the description of what is being talked about:- 1. AI Combat is very challenging to programme for the output of quality gameplay. 2. It appears there are many players who might find pvp combat stressful due to fighting other humans (for whatever underlying reason) whereas a dumb AI does not. This happens in board gaming too, interestingly. 3. PvE combat against AI is an attempt to solve the problem of mining pve (aka player interacting with the environment to secure resources) via some sort of AI combat stimulating challenging = reward of resources, without this apparently being a grind. Let's assume AI combat is a non-starter for the next 2-3yrs due to scope limitations and the fact it's not essential to the game design vision. In the absence how can resource extraction be made stimulating? Well apparently mining triangulation scanning skill-training will be interesting itself. Secondly purposeful logistics of organizations creating supply chains successfully itself will be very stimulating too? Thirdly this will lead to direct combat/pvp itself stimulating as well. Though of course stressful for those who don't like combat against other humans. All in all, there's some audience who want pve combat and it will be their loss to not have it, but I would say that is the FLIP SIDE to the main face of the game which seems on balance it will be more than adequate without such PvE Combat programming development work as per the extraordinary work involved for this scripted content from developers themselves: Which keeps in line with what the devs envision: No dev created structures bar the Arkship? I was also glad to hear JC in an interview point out to a question no "Halloween events" in game: The Virtual World of DU as per it's own background history lore is it's own rationale in game. I like that sense of respect for this creation and it's own internal coherence: This is great world-building ala "Mythopoeia" . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MookMcMook Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 3 hours ago, CaptainTwerkmotor said: That's the plan though. Deal with it. Also, since you have zero clue of this - and its obvious - AI needs its own server (since NPCs are client instances operated by the server). Tell me, how much will the AWS hosting costs skyrocket for NQ, if they were to add PVE, with scripts and how much would it ruin their developement crunch if they were to add pointless PVE, cause YOU are lazy and don't want to mine? DU is not a theme park, they never advertised as a Theme Park. It's a Sandbox. They never said the will add - or want - PVE with dungeons and loot bags. -snip- You want PVE to get materials for your ship? Might as well tell them "make wolves drop money". That's the level of disconnect you have with economics. There's a certain amount of very USEFUL sincerity in Twerk's reply here: Let's base our ideas and our interests in the game with WHAT the devs have explicitly made clear is WITHIN the game's scope and "Vision Mission Statement". Anything outside of this, is a non-starter or a distraction: Nothing can be all things to all people, there has to be limitations, but given the design of DU what is within it's limitations appears to be truly mass scale scope of possibilities, more than enough for most people who are wiling to use a bit of imagination and a bit of effort to "connect" with others. The other critical point above, is the "connection as opposed to disconnection" of a suggestion with the economics in game, too. The old pve and pvp guises are limited categorizations here, they fail in context of systems with other systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felonu Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 32 minutes ago, MookMcMook said: There's a certain amount of very USEFUL sincerity in Twerk's reply here: Let's base our ideas and our interests in the game with WHAT the devs have explicitly made clear is WITHIN the game's scope and "Vision Mission Statement". Anything outside of this, is a non-starter or a distraction: Nothing can be all things to all people, there has to be limitations, but given the design of DU what is within it's limitations appears to be truly mass scale scope of possibilities, more than enough for most people who are wiling to use a bit of imagination and a bit of effort to "connect" with others. The other critical point above, is the "connection as opposed to disconnection" of a suggestion with the economics in game, too. The old pve and pvp guises are limited categorizations here, they fail in context of systems with other systems. As far as NQs vision, they have talked about npcs, and they specifically talk about turning the Ark Ship into a kind of dungeon at some point. The only part I think they have worked on so far might be the NPCs to buy the blueprints you need to make elements (they have another name for this, but on my phone and too lazy to look it up right now). I don’t expect most of this stuff to be in the game at launch but people saying this isn’t in their vision and has never been are simply wrong. I do think NQ hopes the players will make enough content themselves that NQ doesn’t have to fill the game with theme park rides. The idea that PVE is boring and grindy is a fair criticism from a specific standpoint, but I think the click-game of mining is boring and grindy. That doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be in the game. I would much prefer to shoot AI to get my resources than click the ground personally. I don’t expect or actually think that should be the way anything works in DU, but It is definitely my preference in game functionality in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anaximander Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 32 minutes ago, Felonu said: As far as NQs vision, they have talked about npcs, and they specifically talk about turning the Ark Ship into a kind of dungeon at some point. The only part I think they have worked on so far might be the NPCs to buy the blueprints you need to make elements (they have another name for this, but on my phone and too lazy to look it up right now). I don’t expect most of this stuff to be in the game at launch but people saying this isn’t in their vision and has never been are simply wrong. I do think NQ hopes the players will make enough content themselves that NQ doesn’t have to fill the game with theme park rides. The idea that PVE is boring and grindy is a fair criticism from a specific standpoint, but I think the click-game of mining is boring and grindy. That doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be in the game. I would much prefer to shoot AI to get my resources than click the ground personally. I don’t expect or actually think that should be the way anything works in DU, but It is definitely my preference in game functionality in general. Uhm, I am 99.999999% certain NQ doesn't plan for "NPCs" for players to buy the SCHEMATICS from for 3D mesh objects, but more like EVE's thing, where NPCs put up "Skill Books" for sale on markets - which players can buy and go to a far off market and sell them for a profit as well, you know, TRADINGF i nan utshell, buy " low" sell high. Not every planet has an Arkship. That's a pretty sure-shot way of recycling money. So, no, NPCs won't be present, just "bots" (which are not Characters in-game, hence not NPCs, just bots, putting up items for sale like skillbooks or Scehmatics - most likely schematics - and buying cheap resources for money from players as well, like wood or something. At no point, an NPC was ever mentioned. People should stop confusing NPC with Bots. Problem with "shoot, kill, get minerals" is that NPCs, respawn - terrain does not. Inflation is NOT fun, especially in video games. Also, I don't know what kind of "boring" you find in working with others, talking and at the same time, mining, but it's clear to me you never done such a thing. Mining in Korean MMOs or WoW-like games, is not the same as mining in a sandbox- again, DU is a sandbox, you are meant to DIG IN THE FRIGGING SANDBOX WITH THE OTHER CHILDREN. I was on your boat of the arguement before playing EVE, then I had a blast on some mining operations from talking crap on the military director of the alliance and I ever since kept going back into the GROUP ACTIVITY of socialising with the rest of my corporation's mates, as we filled up our banks with minerals, so we don't have to spend money pointlessly -- most alliances in EVE or even corporations, offer you a Ship Replacement Program, basically insurance, if you help on the mining ops and lose your ship in a group activity. At no point NPCs were needed on the above example. Just get into an org and be a team player. It will make you see the arguement from our side of the fence. NPCs belong to singleplayer games, they should have never been in an MMO, at least, not "factions" of NPCs. Animals are coo for NPCs, aside from space-PETA, nobody cares for space zebras or space lions. But hey, if you want to skin 1000 wolves for their fur and make money that way - hopefully NQ will heed my call for dandy woolen siberian jackets - be my guest, you have the right to be a hunter and skinner like I have the right to be a thief and a scoundrel (no, no I don't have any shame on admitting that). Cheers. P.S. : If you find the system of bots "a bit flaud in the long run" it's because it is, nobody with a lick of sense would choose a currency NQ can inflate over time over things like rare materials as their currency. MookMcMook 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MookMcMook Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 55 minutes ago, Felonu said: As far as NQs vision, they have talked about npcs, and they specifically talk about turning the Ark Ship into a kind of dungeon at some point. The only part I think they have worked on so far might be the NPCs to buy the blueprints you need to make elements (they have another name for this, but on my phone and too lazy to look it up right now). I don’t expect most of this stuff to be in the game at launch but people saying this isn’t in their vision and has never been are simply wrong. I do think NQ hopes the players will make enough content themselves that NQ doesn’t have to fill the game with theme park rides. The idea that PVE is boring and grindy is a fair criticism from a specific standpoint, but I think the click-game of mining is boring and grindy. That doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be in the game. I would much prefer to shoot AI to get my resources than click the ground personally. I don’t expect or actually think that should be the way anything works in DU, but It is definitely my preference in game functionality in general. NPCs for blueprints is no doubt part of the economic apparatus. It's not PvE combat content. I'm sure NQ have auxillery ideas about PvE combat content... but like I said it's a non-starter for the next few years: Let's review how much money NQ has to make DU actually first of all work via the tech, increase the performance, THEN get onto the complex game systems ALREADY feature set as per the front page of the new website eg politics, combat (war) etc and THEN ensure they're FUN and integrate holistically with the rest of the game's systems over the long-term too. That's why I think Twerk's level of SINCERITY is admirable: It's actually conducive to expectation setting and useful ideas being shared FROM what the devs have actually feature set for the scope of the game. There's the categories that are non-starters and actually counter-productive:- * I want my own single-player server DU. * I want a complete F2P non sub payment for DU. * I want PvE AI combat because other players combat PvP is stressful to me. As much as everyone wishes for their own preferences for whatever reason, it's heedless to not check the FAQ (well the new one is under construction perhaps atm) nor meet the devs on their own terms. If I walk into a Steak House and start making requests for Vegan Food, what does that make me? We're not talking about what is actually on the menu. I suppose all the above preferences are a form of "special pleading"? Which is all I'm trying to point out, and believe to be the correct categorization involved here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felonu Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 1 hour ago, CaptainTwerkmotor said: Uhm, I am 99.999999% certain NQ doesn't plan for "NPCs" for players to buy the SCHEMATICS from for 3D mesh objects, but more like EVE's thing, where NPCs put up "Skill Books" for sale on markets - which players can buy and go to a far off market and sell them for a profit as well, you know, TRADINGF i nan utshell, buy " low" sell high. Not every planet has an Arkship. That's a pretty sure-shot way of recycling money. So, no, NPCs won't be present, just "bots" (which are not Characters in-game, hence not NPCs, just bots, putting up items for sale like skillbooks or Scehmatics - most likely schematics - and buying cheap resources for money from players as well, like wood or something. At no point, an NPC was ever mentioned. People should stop confusing NPC with Bots. Problem with "shoot, kill, get minerals" is that NPCs, respawn - terrain does not. Inflation is NOT fun, especially in video games. Also, I don't know what kind of "boring" you find in working with others, talking and at the same time, mining, but it's clear to me you never done such a thing. Mining in Korean MMOs or WoW-like games, is not the same as mining in a sandbox- again, DU is a sandbox, you are meant to DIG IN THE FRIGGING SANDBOX WITH THE OTHER CHILDREN. I was on your boat of the arguement before playing EVE, then I had a blast on some mining operations from talking crap on the military director of the alliance and I ever since kept going back into the GROUP ACTIVITY of socialising with the rest of my corporation's mates, as we filled up our banks with minerals, so we don't have to spend money pointlessly -- most alliances in EVE or even corporations, offer you a Ship Replacement Program, basically insurance, if you help on the mining ops and lose your ship in a group activity. At no point NPCs were needed on the above example. Just get into an org and be a team player. It will make you see the arguement from our side of the fence. NPCs belong to singleplayer games, they should have never been in an MMO, at least, not "factions" of NPCs. Animals are coo for NPCs, aside from space-PETA, nobody cares for space zebras or space lions. But hey, if you want to skin 1000 wolves for their fur and make money that way - hopefully NQ will heed my call for dandy woolen siberian jackets - be my guest, you have the right to be a hunter and skinner like I have the right to be a thief and a scoundrel (no, no I don't have any shame on admitting that). Cheers. P.S. : If you find the system of bots "a bit flaud in the long run" it's because it is, nobody with a lick of sense would choose a currency NQ can inflate over time over things like rare materials as their currency. You are correct he did say purchasing through the market which would imply that they would be bots. He called them NPCs and I hadn't remembered the market part. As far as mining vs killing things goes, I wasn't stating that I want that in this game. As I stated in the following sentence, in general I prefer one mechanic over the other. I was illustrating a point about different peoples ideas of what is fun. As an aside, you can have the same interaction while shooting metal aliens to get copper that you can have while following a vein of copper. It can also be enhanced if that metal alien has to flushed out by a group of your friends while you line up the shot. Hunting can take skill and a coordinated team. AGAIN, I WANT TO BE CLEAR, I'M TALKING ABOUT CONCEPTS. I AM IN NO WAY ADVOCATING REPLACING MINING WITH KILLING OR ACTUAL COPPER ALIENS TO BE IN THIS GAME. Animal NPCs dropping fur would have the same issues as other types of NPCs dropping other matts - they still take AI scripting, and they are still regenerating which inflates whatever they drop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anaximander Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 3 minutes ago, Felonu said: You are correct he did say purchasing through the market which would imply that they would be bots. He called them NPCs and I hadn't remembered the market part. As far as mining vs killing things goes, I wasn't stating that I want that in this game. As I stated in the following sentence, in general I prefer one mechanic over the other. I was illustrating a point about different peoples ideas of what is fun. As an aside, you can have the same interaction while shooting metal aliens to get copper that you can have while following a vein of copper. It can also be enhanced if that metal alien has to flushed out by a group of your friends while you line up the shot. Hunting can take skill and a coordinated team. AGAIN, I WANT TO BE CLEAR, I'M TALKING ABOUT CONCEPTS. I AM IN NO WAY ADVOCATING REPLACING MINING WITH KILLING OR ACTUAL COPPER ALIENS TO BE IN THIS GAME. Animal NPCs dropping fur would have the same issues as other types of NPCs dropping other matts - they still take AI scripting, and they are still regenerating which inflates whatever they drop. Yes, but see, FUR cannot reinforce a ship's bow. Steel can. That's the vital difference. Fur won't make a differnece in gameplay, steel will. And wolves for example., CAN procreate and spread REALLY fast. A patcho of earth can't procreate to expalin how it came back. That's why "fur" being abundant is okay, cause it's cosmetic, not really an armor. And to be honest, a wolf or -gasps- space wolf, is not needing the sam AI as an alien, with a gun, meant to use "tactics". A wolf canpass as a "simple minded beast", an alien with a gun cannot. of course, And to be clear, I'd have no issue for PVE to be more "reactive" and less "organised". If the PVE is tied to the survival in the game - later coming or on launch - the PVE should be that, Player Versus Enviroment. Predators should act like Predators, not like ducks on Duck Hunt. You go out mining at night? Well, predators spawn at night and those guys got a degree in proctology, so they will tear you a new one. I personally, am tired of the "go there, farm 10000 mobs, go back to the quest giver, hand 10000 bunny ears, get money". NQ should make PVE more like "Horde Mode Survival" to keep your territory claim safe, and less "ClicheQuest" (props if you get the referrence, you strike me as of the older demographic, so you may do). In that regard, yes, that kind of PVE Event can happen, swarm AI is not difficult to handle and since DU uses Territory claims, NQ can programm the Territory Claims to act as a "waypoint" the mobs try to appraoch, attacking anything on their path or trying to overcome obstacles towards the Territory claim if they detect a path. Of course, that, the pathfinding is the bane of any video game AI's developer's existence. Pathfindin g is not easy. And hey, if it can be weaponised by "luring" NPCs to an area (essentailly ,having a way to spawn NPCs with literal lures) , who knows, maybe we would have things like the Walking Dead's comicbooks, "The Whisperers". No spoilers, you can look up what those a-holes do, but you wil lget the idea. So, NQ, would have quite a while before they can make pathfinding for said "swarm AIs" work without them feeling dump or like the zombies on the Walking Dead (or any zombie game that exists, they all use the same stupid AI script xD ). P.S. : Fun fact, even WoW on the Broken Isles quests, made fun of the cliche "get me 1000 of these items" quests with the quest giver, Khadgar, telling you "oh yeah, about that thing... I only needed one, oops!". If Blizzard makes fun of it, you know it's bad... Lethys and MookMcMook 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felonu Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 5 minutes ago, CaptainTwerkmotor said: Yes, but see, FUR cannot reinforce a ship's bow. Steel can. That's the vital difference. Fur won't make a differnece in gameplay, steel will. And wolves for example., CAN procreate and spread REALLY fast. A patcho of earth can't procreate to expalin how it came back. That's why "fur" being abundant is okay, cause it's cosmetic, not really an armor. And to be honest, a wolf or -gasps- space wolf, is not needing the sam AI as an alien, with a gun, meant to use "tactics". A wolf canpass as a "simple minded beast", an alien with a gun cannot. of course, And to be clear, I'd have no issue for PVE to be more "reactive" and less "organised". If the PVE is tied to the survival in the game - later coming or on launch - the PVE should be that, Player Versus Enviroment. Predators should act like Predators, not like ducks on Duck Hunt. You go out mining at night? Well, predators spawn at night and those guys got a degree in proctology, so they will tear you a new one. I personally, am tired of the "go there, farm 10000 mobs, go back to the quest giver, hand 10000 bunny ears, get money". NQ should make PVE more like "Horde Mode Survival" to keep your territory claim safe, and less "ClicheQuest" (props if you get the referrence, you strike me as of the older demographic, so you may do). In that regard, yes, that kind of PVE Event can happen, swarm AI is not difficult to handle and since DU uses Territory claims, NQ can programm the Territory Claims to act as a "waypoint" the mobs try to appraoch, attacking anything on their path or trying to overcome obstacles towards the Territory claim if they detect a path. Of course, that, the pathfinding is the bane of any video game AI's developer's existence. Pathfindin g is not easy. And hey, if it can be weaponised by "luring" NPCs to an area (essentailly ,having a way to spawn NPCs with literal lures) , who knows, maybe we would have things like the Walking Dead's comicbooks, "The Whisperers". No spoilers, you can look up what those a-holes do, but you wil lget the idea. So, NQ, would have quite a while before they can make pathfinding for said "swarm AIs" work without them feeling dump or like the zombies on the Walking Dead (or any zombie game that exists, they all use the same stupid AI script xD ). P.S. : Fun fact, even WoW on the Broken Isles quests, made fun of the cliche "get me 1000 of these items" quests with the quest giver, Khadgar, telling you "oh yeah, about that thing... I only needed one, oops!". If Blizzard makes fun of it, you know it's bad... Wow, I'm kinda shocked. I can actually agree with you here. There is a middle ground that would be possible, and could actually have PVE in the game in some form. Whether NQ decides to do it or not is up to them, and I'll be happy either way. Lethys and Anaximander 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunDeva Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 PvE is not boring like Takao said. It really comes down to your play style and what you want to do in that world. A lot of PvP players feel like you do but a lot of PvE players don't care for PvP because they feel its a complete gank and grief fest. Traditionally most MMO's have PvP and PvE and in my experience PvE servers of the same game usually have larger populations. Dual Universe is trying something new and have a little something for everyone on one serve so things like people getting upset about the possibility of a small safe zone on planets when you compare the scope of the planets and the solar systems seems like a silly argument. You will have people that all they want to do is build thing which will help the economy and enrich the construction in DU. Don't worry PvP players there will be plenty of action for you because if you have ben following the Dev Diary's you know most people will not be able to stay in that safe zone for too long : land is very expensive there and you cant mine resources ! MookMcMook and Supermega 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MookMcMook Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 18 minutes ago, GunDeva said: PvE is not boring like Takao said. It really comes down to your play style and what you want to do in that world. A lot of PvP players feel like you do but a lot of PvE players don't care for PvP because they feel its a complete gank and grief fest. Traditionally most MMO's have PvP and PvE and in my experience PvE servers of the same game usually have larger populations. Dual Universe is trying something new and have a little something for everyone on one serve so things like people getting upset about the possibility of a small safe zone on planets when you compare the scope of the planets and the solar systems seems like a silly argument. You will have people that all they want to do is build thing which will help the economy and enrich the construction in DU. Don't worry PvP players there will be plenty of action for you because if you have ben following the Dev Diary's you know most people will not be able to stay in that safe zone for too long : land is very expensive there and you cant mine resources ! Exactly right: It's going to be HUGE SCALE virtual world space. * Building and creating and trading and socializing and services are going to be very popular in such areas that have stability. The equivalent of the old out-dated pve-combat content. * The pvp combat will likely be big fleet battles on the edges of such empires, with dog-fights "anything goes" in the outer reach lawless rimworld et al. zones and new systems....... with new resources and whatnot. GunDeva 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atmosph3rik Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 The asteroid thing might be something worth exploring. Some kind of randomized space rocks that drift into our explorable space and back out eventually. They could contain rare elements or high concentrations of valuable materials. Finding them and exploiting them, protecting them and keeping them secret, could all make for some interesting gameplay. As long as it felt realistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoreVamore Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 4 hours ago, Atmosph3rik said: The asteroid thing might be something worth exploring. Some kind of randomized space rocks that drift into our explorable space and back out eventually. They could contain rare elements or high concentrations of valuable materials. Finding them and exploiting them, protecting them and keeping them secret, could all make for some interesting gameplay. As long as it felt realistic. NQ has said that asteroids will be static units, no movement, no drifting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atmosph3rik Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 hour ago, CoreVamore said: NQ has said that asteroids will be static units, no movement, no drifting. In addition to those static build-able asteroids. Call em rogue asteroids or something. Not orbiting anything in our exploitable space. It's just an interesting thought. I like that idea of strange stuff drifting through space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurock Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Is this where we put in an order for a nice big double helping of asteroid belt? Belters gotta live somewhere I like the idea of drifting asteroids, if at all possible, though I expect we would only see something like this after release if at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoreVamore Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 29 minutes ago, Kurock said: Is this where we put in an order for a nice big double helping of asteroid belt? Belters gotta live somewhere I like the idea of drifting asteroids, if at all possible, though I expect we would only see something like this after release if at all. there is nothing stopping you from making a space ship look like an asteroid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ajb69 Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 not going to read all of the comments but im with commanderlouiz i dont think thay are going for that kind of thing but if what thay are saying is right there is nothing stoping us doing it get a warlord to host it some well off players to bet on the outcome win win if you ask me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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