Builders Guild Certification [and do we need it?]

[Kasmilos]

So I was wondering if the following would be something people would be interested in:

 

What:

A competency certification for the various  building disciplines.

 

Why:

DU is giving a LOT of space for player creativity. This will mean that the 80/20 rule will be in strong evidence. 

Every one CAN build, but not every one can build WELL. If you cant build and you are looking for some one to build for you, it would be nice to have some prior knowledge of what they can do. Auditions are not practical, especially if it involves expensive materials.

 

How:

You take a competency test with a guild representative. The test will give a set of parameters to build to. The construct is judged according to a determined schedule. The result is a pass or fail. A pass is recorded in the guild for that person. A fail is only recorded with a date to allow some time to pass before a new attempt is made.

Difficulty levels have to be completed in order. For instance, you have to complete basic hovercraft building, before you can attempt racer building.

 

If the person you wish to engage for a construction is registered with the guild, you know that they have completed a project to the stated specification satisfactorily at least once.

 

 

[Lethys]

Well, try it. Maybe people need that, maybe not.

 

I personally wouldn't use or trust such a certificate because a good and we'll rounded ship to me may be vastly different than it is to you. 

 

I only trust myself there and if I think it's good, I'll buy it. Trust (ship building wise) has to be earned hard, cause I don't want to fly a ship that may turn against me in the middle of a fight

[Kurock]

DU you have your construction license?

 

It may be advantageous to go to a org known for building and have that org worry about the aptitude of their own builders, though I do see this being useful for general jobs that are open to all neutral parties. A more likely place for certification may be ships themselves that are to be sold on the open market.

 

TLDR: Just DU it.

[Anaximander]

I think there should be this, and hopefully ,a group may emerge for community projects that can provide "experience" in a person's bio on "this person worked on X project", so alliances can hire with care.

[Eternal]

So you wanna create this Trades-field for this Industry? A "certificate" is for Trades (example; Welding)

My ideas; 

*have a Polytechnical-Institute that will teach students the basic of technicalities.

*make a standard-Logbook of tasks graduated-students/apprentices must complete in training/on-job-training that graduated-superior/s must sign in order to validate their completion of training.

*make a rank for the Industry that will define experience and also pay; apprentice < journeyman < master

*make a red-seal(that's what we call it in Canada) or whatever for graduated-apprentice, a journeyman-technician in other terms, that will represent acknowledgement in competence regarding the field. Ofcourse, once they meet all the requirements and experience, they have to write and pass a red-seal-exam.

 

What I'm pointing-out here, are processes for Technicians. Technician is a blue-collared-job.

 

How about Prof.-Engineers? They must go to University and complete their higher-education and earn their Bachelor's degree(ofcourse, they have a choice to continue their education and go for an Academic-Degree. A Master's Degree in Science & IT where you will be referred to as a Doctor or a Physicist). After graduation, students must complete a PPE(an exam) in order to be considered a licensed-practitioner (you cannot be literally considered an "Engineer" just because you graduated from an Engineering-program! You have to be licensed, and for that, you have to pass the PPE and meet the academic-requirements.)

 

To run an Institute/University, you must have a competent school-board and certified-professors. Some of these professors, they coordinate the materials they themselves teach. Materials that are up to the industry-standards and recent(not out-of-date).

 

An education-system like this will prepare people to be competent and productive in the industry. It will also be a bragging-rights. Give us schools like the Harvard-University. Ofcourse, education does not define how competent you are, but it should act as a reinforcement to solidify your portfolio. This should define influence also. 

 

 

[Eternal]

So if you wanna run a school-system, you must create a good curriculum and have a Ministry of Education within your Guild that will receive Public-fundings in order to operate and supervise the education-standards up to post-secondary-level. They must ensure that education-system within the country remains globally competent. Ofcourse, you are gonna have Foreign-Students/International-Students, they must be approved and pay more tuition than domestic-students. 

Diplomas? You will make them online and the ministry himself will actually sign it(via paint-tool). So it's harder to fake! He will sign it and it will go on the department-records.

example;

[Kasmilos]

6 hours ago, Eternal said:

An education-system like this will prepare people to be competent and productive in the industry. It will also be a bragging-rights. Give us schools like the Harvard-University. Ofcourse, education does not define how competent you are, but it should act as a reinforcement to solidify your portfolio. This should define influence also. 

 

The bit I am proposing does not include the education system. Just the competency testing. The "Education system" will start with the in game tutorials and then probably continue with tutorials published elsewhere (YouTube etc).

 

[Kasmilos]

7 hours ago, CaptainTwerkmotor said:

I think there should be this, and hopefully ,a group may emerge for community projects that can provide "experience" in a person's bio on "this person worked on X project", so alliances can hire with care.

This is of course another model. Just have a registry of projects and who did what on that project. This would work well for large public projects.

Roles here would include:

• Designer
• Primary construction
• Detail construction
• Scripting
• Managing
• etc...

The tricky bit here is that it is likely that some projects will be secret so it will be hard to judge by others. It will also probably not include "small" projects like building a hovercraft or an orbital launch vehicle. This might be fine, given that you are more likely to hire a stranger for a large project than a small one.

[SirJohn85]

I will not use such a service or certificate in this form.

 

Why does it just make you think you're in charge of this certificate authority? Which qualifications do you bring with you? Maybe something from the RL? I am asking this as a trained draftsman (building construction) in RL.

 

Usually builders of such works self-announce who worked on it. The best example is in Minecraft or Space Engineers. I go straight there and ask or hire those who are relevant to me.

[Kasmilos]

2 hours ago, SirJohn85 said:

Why does it just make you think you're in charge of this certificate authority?

The intention here is not to set up some one "in charge", but to create public awareness. The "in charge" bit would reside in setting the tests. No single person has the knowledge and skill to set them all. It will have to be a collaborative effort. If practical it should also be an open an public process.

Obviously there will have to be some kind of evaluation against the set criteria. Doing this by comity should keep the "in charge"ness of any individual to a minimum. The internal workings of such a guild would have to revolve around demonstrated skills, willingness and ability to evaluate the work of others.

Note that there is no "code of conduct" or rules for how you need to do your thing. You simply demonstrate that you can do a certain thing and you get your name on a list.

 

Quote

Which qualifications do you bring with you? Maybe something from the RL? I am asking this as a trained draftsman (building construction) in RL.

It is not entirely clear what RL skills will translate into skills needed in game yet. We can guess the following:

• CAD/3D Modelling (to use the tools well)
• Drafting in general (to turn an idea into a construct)
• Engineering (mechanical, for the physics engine)
• Coding (LUA in particular, but others in general)
• Architecture
• Design
• others....

And just because I can code, does not mean I will automatically code well in game. That has to be established in the game itself.

 

Quote

Usually builders of such works self-announce who worked on it. The best example is in Minecraft or Space Engineers. I go straight there and ask or hire those who are relevant to me.

You are referring to public constructs. If I were to build a secret base for some one on an asteroid, by its very nature others will not know about it. I suspect there might be a fair bit of this happening in DU.

On the other extreme, if I am lucky enough to build something very public in a high traffic area, I am bound to be noticed, despite the quality of my work.

If I design and build a super cruiser for the Pirates of Doom or the Righteous Fist of Law there is a reputation attached to that which I might want to avoid in public.

[Eternal]

19 hours ago, Kasmilos said:

The bit I am proposing does not include the education system. Just the competency testing. The "Education system" will start with the in game tutorials and then probably continue with tutorials published elsewhere (YouTube etc).

A Trades-Seal then? In other words, an "apprenticeship to a journeyman"-program. Well, that's the point of Certification. Certification is acknowledgement of completion of training, if we are talking about Trades, then it's practical-training. You said "recognition of competence", that is Trades-Seal, in Canada(only in Canada), we call it Red-Seal. Point of it, is recognition of competence in the field(meaning you are no longer an Apprentice).

 

Ofcourse, things like this, it can only be recognized in and within your Guild-Structure(aka your Country), unless we will have our own International-standards. If you graduate from an Engineering-program from another-country, don't you know that you can't use that in Canada? You can, if there is an International-standards. In terms of Aerospace-Engineering, we were taught the Aviation-Regulation of Canada(that is based in CARS. For Manufacturing, we follow the American-standards), it is all different across the globe, and how would I know the regulations of FAA and other foreign-standards if I didn't studied them? Even Japanese-Railway-standards are different. Only standards applicable to a country is recognized. Unless ofcourse, we have an International-standards or portable-standards between countries. For example; Driver's License. In Canada, an American Driver's License is a recognized-equivalent because their standards are the same (Same road and sign rules, same strictness and length-procedure. but in other country, it's different). You can exchange your American Driver's License with minimal due-process, because in Canada, it takes ****ing 3-years to get your graduated-Driver's-License.

 

Unless there is portability(Guild-to-Guild) or International-Standards, your Trades-Seal will only be recognized within your Guild(Country). Your Guild will have it's own competence-regulation. Regulation and law has it's due-process, you will minimize it and make the process simpler, ofcourse, without compromising competence.

[Felonu]

I believe it would be more analogous to college accreditation.  The more respected the institution that provides the certificate, the more likely it will carry across more borders.  

 

An idea like this is what makes immergent gameplay so exciting for a lot of us.  If you have an idea like this, then try building an org or a branch of an org dedicated to it.  Advertise your proficiency in some aspect of building, and see if you can get people to come to you to certify that they have sound practices making similar types of things.

[Precise_Calibre]

A competent builder-for-hire or designer will have their own portfolio of previously completed works available for perusal, along with testimonials from those they have worked with in the past.