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TheLongWorm

Game Balancing(Automatik mining etc), additional Jobs and more gameplay mechanics

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-Rewirthen some of the text-


 


First of all, I like where you're going with your Project, but I have some Ideas that may make the Game even better. I believe in your Project so I have supported the Kickstarter with 120 Euros.  :D


 


(-Removed the part about automatet mining!-)


 


Balancing: It should not be Easy to build Spaceships, but you have to calculate a lot of things, such as: Gravity, Thrust, and Speed to make thing more efficent its should be like if you want get the maximum out of an ship you have to Construct it smart:


                                                                                           Thrust


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


(Hull+Fuel+Thrusters+Electrical components+Generator+Antennas(to communicate with other players),Wires (to Transfer Electric Energy))


 


Wires: As I already stated, they should Transfer Energy form A to B which would make a nice Mechanic on Planets; however, if you transfer too much power they should melt, but there would be different kinds of Cables,small, Normal, Large and Superconductive cables thous are more expensiv but have no Energy lose and can Transver Inf Energy.


 


 


Antennas: They should have a Range in witch player can Commonicate with it other so that it will be an big thing to build Antennas and Satalites evry were that Player can commonicate over large distances and they of cores need all Energy so Commonication wont be free and we wont get the classic MMO style spam chat that would Lead to many Epic moments if you just loses Contact with one of youre organisation Ships and it would be amezing for player how just want to explore the world they may dont know that there is an Huge City on that Planet so this would lead to some amezing exploration moments if there would just be an completet other System of diffrent Organisation witch dont know an other System of other Organisations. 


 


Balancing: Piloting an Ship should not be Easy you have to know where the Wires and generators are to have an Idea how mutch DMG your ship has. And you have to know with howmutch Fuel you can made it out of Orbit and land on the Planet and how mutch wight you can have Loaded to doing so so you might want to have somone else looking for the power Systems, and somone how running around and Fixing stuff untill the ship is broken and then comes the Gravety pull and pulls the ship on the planet bur the Players build in an Emerganzy pots so they got shot out of the ship an go slowly down on to the Planet while the ship is crashing and make an big Hole in to the ground with an large explosen.


 


Next idea Energy Shilds to Protect Buildings for Griefer that want to destroy stuff by crashing things into stuff  *just kidding(after the and)* :D


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The devs already stated that there WILL NOT BE ANY MININGSHIPS, because they don't want to brake the game for newbros. Read the other threads about that topic.

 

To the second part: I don't even know where to start with this one

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Balancing: Piloting an Ship should not be Easy you have to know where the Wires and generators are to have an Idea how mutch DMG your ship has. And you have to know with howmutch Fuel you can made it out of Orbit and land on the Planet and how mutch wight you can have Loaded to doing so.

 

Okay i did not read it all but this caught my eye. My response is just "no". Making a game advanced like this will scare people away and a lot of players (me included) would see it more as chore than a fun game.

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The devs already stated that there WILL NOT BE ANY MININGSHIPS, because they don't want to brake the game for newbros. Read the other threads about that topic.

 

To the second part: I don't even know where to start with this one

Yes i know but you will be able to just do your own thing and mine and sell the stuff if you want to buy somting there is no problem with that. Risk and Cost of the Mining machines will make minerals not less expensiv if its done right.

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Okay i did not read it all but this caught my eye. My response is just "no". Making a game advanced like this will scare people away and a lot of players (me included) would see it more as chore than a fun game.

Well my opinion is exactly contrary to this, its not that complycatet at all its just harder and needs more planing. This is simple you just add all components that are using energy add the energy they use and then you put the right WIre in for that max amount of energy transver simple and then just add this electric component infront of the generator, simple evryone can do this its just do have more option to wire the ship more inteligent and thats CvC makes more fun if You can hit Wires that Separets Engiens or somting like that so u dont have to destroy the complet ship to take it out so get more out of the ship. But this will only be Relavant in space on Planets you just have to look that you just dont Kill your wires by useing to mutch energy there is no problem with that and it comes to some pretty funny sitation :)

 

 

 

Its just one thing u have to do more that will effect the way you play the game and you can go to an Organisation and they will give you an function like well Build the Inside/Outside of this Ship they will explane to you how to make the electic stuff if you want to make if if you dont want to make it there is no Problem.

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I think Devs just said there'll not be any automated mining. Mining ships will probably be in the game (maybe in an expansion), like it is in eve online, but with proper balancing, so no ridicolous amount of stuff mined that would break the economy and ruin the landscape.

 

@Zorac this game is not for everyone. If it will not be complex enough to give replayability for months or years, the P2P model will not work and the game will inevitably die. 

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I think Devs just said there'll not be any automated mining. Mining ships will probably be in the game (maybe in an expansion), like it is in eve online, but with proper balancing, so no ridicolous amount of stuff mined that would break the economy and ruin the landscape.

No becouse its so Hard to do this that you need like 100 People a Month working on it and u wont get so mutch out of it then its just replace 100 People mining its not Worth at all becouse you have to repair it and there will by anyway 100'000 People Mining so that will be only like 1% of the Mined Ores so its just for player how are sick of mining but it will be hard anyway. And even if you do it on a Planet it will get so Expensiv the transport it to an other Planet that its better to simply mine there the Stuff and if youre in the orbit to Mine there the stuff u need. so it wont be unbalnced just an option that you dont have to do somting and replace it with some other way of doing it.

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If mass mining is for players who are sick of mining then dont mine, do something else.

 

If there is no real benefit to mass mining over manual mining, then why include it at all?

 

How would mass mining work in practice? A machine that tunnels? That wont work because veins will not be straight lines (I think).

 

Again if you think manual mining is boring, do something else.

JC explained that there wont be mining ships. For economical reasons and social reasons. You can suggest whatever you want but a productive idea is proposing something that works within the rules of the game.

 

If you disagree with a feature then you need to get familiar with the available information and make a case for why your idea is better. :)

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@Zorac this game is not for everyone. If it will not be complex enough to give replayability for months or years, the P2P model will not work and the game will inevitably die. 

 

Yes i agree with that but there needs to be a balance as well.. I have played one or two very advanced games, although fun the playerbase is way to small because of it being so niche genre. Making it hard to fly ships is not the way to go in order give a game more replayability.

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Yes i agree with that but there needs to be a balance as well.. I have played one or two very advanced games, although fun the playerbase is way to small because of it being so niche genre. Making it hard to fly ships is not the way to go in order give a game more replayability.

Its should not be Hard to Fly you simply should have more stuff that you have to Controll so it could be usfull that have an other pilot controlling the Ships system of Overheat and DMG  especially in fights so thats there is a dude looking for evry system and then he sees like oh well we have dmg on cabel to of the Rightside of the ship we have to powerdown some systems or the cable will melt, and send somone to go there and look waths where the DMG is he may could Fix it!

 

That are sitation I would love to see in this game people have to know theyre ship and not evry ship is the same just that some part are on diffrent possitions and if theyre destroyed ur ship is destroyed its simpler but do you want to tell me its more fun that way?

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If mass mining is for players who are sick of mining then dont mine, do something else.

 

If there is no real benefit to mass mining over manual mining, then why include it at all?

 

How would mass mining work in practice? A machine that tunnels? That wont work because veins will not be straight lines (I think).

 

Again if you think manual mining is boring, do something else.

JC explained that there wont be mining ships. For economical reasons and social reasons. You can suggest whatever you want but a productive idea is proposing something that works within the rules of the game.

 

If you disagree with a feature then you need to get familiar with the available information and make a case for why your idea is better. :)

Yea I think the Idea they have is Briliant with yes if you dont want to do that u can do that the problem with that is if other people dont want to do an Task as well that mean you have to buff Handminingdrills so that theyre faster then even more people dont want to mine so you have to buff it agen and agen the point is if you have mining in the game you need to make it exciting witch is pretty mutch impossible if you ask me unles you do it like mincraft and dont make Ore clusters and just spreaded ores and make large large Caves that go deeep in to the ground well then i have to say OMG YES lets go mining! ^^

 

but i gues that would be harder to make then Automatet mining.

 

if that not happend mining would be just farming it would be the same thing then killing allways the same Monster in an "classic" MMO no one want to do that it gets so boaring you just do becouse you want the next level to get better in the game. so letz remove the boaring Framing stuff.....

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It's too painful to read, argument invalidated requires grammar revisions. Here, I'll rewrite it so its legible (although I don't agree with everything here.)

 

First of all, I like where you're going with your Project, but I have some Ideas that may make the Game even better. I believe in your Project so I have supported the Kickstarter with 120 Euros.  :D

 

Balancing: Mining machines should be expensive as well as complicated to build. Not everyone should be in a position to build such machines. They should explode easily if players don't monitor the automated Mining machine; in order to, force players to Players repair them. These machines would be confined to running from point A to point B (unclear meaning). The risk to run such an machine would be gigantic if there are no friendly players around. This mining system should replace 100 Miners; however, this won't be a problem? Players should not be forced to mine, and if they are forced to mine, but they don't like doing it, they would have the ability to construct and operate these mining machines. This would make them invaluable in the mining industry.

Balancing: It should not be Easy to build Spaceships, but you have to calculate a lot of things, such as: Gravity, Thrust, and Speed:

                                                                                           Thrust

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

(Hull+Fuel+Thrusters+Electrical components+Generator+Antennas(to communicate with other players),Wires (to Transfer Electric Energy))

 

Wires: As I already stated, they should Transfer Energy form A to B which would make a nice Mechanic on Planets; however, if you transfer too much power they should melt, but there would be different kinds of Cables,small, Normal, Large and Superconductive cables

 

 

That's it this is too painful I change my mind I'm out.

 

 

small u can Transver an ammount of ennergy, normal more , Large even more, Superconductiv Infinitiv and there should be No Isolatet version of those as well to Electroshock other players if they touch it. how ever it would add an other dimansion to the game if the player have to Connect to eatch other and Burn Rescourses to doing that.

 

Antennas: They should have a Range in witch player can commonicate with it other so that it will be an big thing to build Antennas and satalites evry were that player can commonicate over large distances and they of cores need all Energy 

 

Balancing: Piloting an Ship should not be Easy you have to know where the Wires and generators are to have an Idea how mutch DMG your ship has. And you have to know with howmutch Fuel you can made it out of Orbit and land on the Planet and how mutch wight you can have Loaded to doing so.

 

Balancing: There is an Huge advantage to build well Protectet Spacestation that can Fuel Ships in Space you have to Look that Ships can make it to Space but burn all theyre Full by doing it so They have to Refuel theyre ships all the times. To go to other Planet systems you can now simply build an Huge Portal in both system witch will allow players to simply and fast change system with out the need flying there

but this should be Massivly expensiv and should not be possible with out the People that Live on the other Planet and building a Huge portel aswell and you should be be able to commonicate with them ture the Portel but until then players need to fly there to commonicate or build an large Line of Satalits but they will get Piratet wath brings me to the next Piont

 

Balancing: Spacepirates Space should be an Huge PvP/CVC Place were evry one should be able to destroy and pick up the Reacursens they Spacestation/Satalit/Spaceship has but all this thing will be well protectet that will mean nothing in Space is Save if you and your organization has like an Astroyed station you need People up there Protecting  it  24/7 and Apply Help if it gets attackt from S.P.

Planets should be Savezone or at least some of them but in Space should be all PvP/CvC to make the game even Harder.

 

Balancing: Organisations should be able to make Pace unther eatch other so that PvP/CvC in Space under them is no Longer Allowed.

 

Balancing: this changes will make Rescoures from other Planets more expensiv becouse its mutch easier to transver Ores from A to B on planets then Brining it from Space or To space to an other Solarsystem and land it agen savely on the planet. So there ways to make it mutch less Expensiv if some Planets have leak of Gold , Iron or Copper so u can Compansate the needes both Planet have but it wont be easy for them becous of Bad commonication Spacepirates etc.

 

 

The effect of all of those changes is That evry task you do in the game got more complycatet expansiv or dangerous so you simply dont want that Random People do somting in the electric, that could blow up you completet Energy system of the complet Planet or that somone build an gigantic Spaceship where the cables begining to Melt and drop back in halfway to the way to Orbit to the Planet and you will need Miletary Force to protect importen and expaniv Spaceobjects wath i think will the game make mutch more Job/Task System Monitoring, Elecric Building, Data Transfer(messages, blueprints Technology)

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Mining is like minecraft. It is not node based. They will try to include caves and lava mechanics.

 

There will be plenty of people mining. Many people including myself like how it currently is designed.

 

Have a look on the forum, read the available info. Take some time listening to the interviews on youtube. I think it might help you out. :)

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Mining is like minecraft. It is not node based. They will try to include caves and lava mechanics.

 

There will be plenty of people mining. Many people including myself like how it currently is designed.

 

Have a look on the forum, read the available info. Take some time listening to the interviews on youtube. I think it might help you out. :)

Ok that nice i would love to go in a Cave to the Core of the Planet and i have no problem with this game mechanic if i dont have to do it and if there are people how want to do it :D

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Mining is like minecraft. It is not node based. They will try to include caves and lava mechanics.

 

There will be plenty of people mining. Many people including myself like how it currently is designed.

 

Have a look on the forum, read the available info. Take some time listening to the interviews on youtube. I think it might help you out. :)

And i did look some Interviews on youtube and i did know they allready sayed there will maybe after the full Version autmatet mining some how that is my way wath ever i have alpha accses in some month so lets see how good the mining mechanics then will be i probebly will come back then when i accualy played the game and can say how the mechanic's are may i will say that the mining is so brilliant that im happy with the way it will be then if not its still Alpha and will may change. So i think i will pick this topic after i accualy mined in the game :D

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As a MMO, the game has to be accessible to a large number of people throughout the life of the game while at the same time have replayability.

 

If flying mechanics are too complicated, it will never be accessible to a large number of people.  In my opinion, NQ has attempted to strike the perfect balance here.  You build a ship with elements and the game will autoconfigure it; yet, players can get into the code to specialize and add efficiency.  The system is accessible while having plenty of replay value in terms of configuring new ships.

 

Any kind of mass mining will eventually make the game inaccessible for new players.  Both because they will not be able to compete in gathering resources and also because mass mining will lead to too much of a resource advantage for existing players.

 

Personally, I hope some resources can be mass mined to an extent; for example, minerals used to build buildings or the basic structure of space stations.  I don't think mass mining these resources will necessarily ruin gameplay and we will need a lot these resources if we are going to build the cities and structures the developers want us to build.

 

Ultimately, the replay value comes from the emergent gameplay.  It will be up to us to make the game continually interesting.

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Automatic or large mining won't happen since the devs believe that will kill the mining gameplay for new players. Any increase in mining efficiency will likely occur with skills or nanoformer upgrades and even then it won't be much better than default.

 

Piloting a ship shouldn't be difficult if built correctly. Building it correctly could be difficult depending on circumstances.

 

Everything mentioned about player interaction is going to be left up to the players entirely. One of the great things about DU will be the emergent gameplay.

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As a MMO, the game has to be accessible to a large number of people throughout the life of the game while at the same time have replayability.

 

If flying mechanics are too complicated, it will never be accessible to a large number of people.  In my opinion, NQ has attempted to strike the perfect balance here.  You build a ship with elements and the game will autoconfigure it; yet, players can get into the code to specialize and add efficiency.  The system is accessible while having plenty of replay value in terms of configuring new ships.

 

Any kind of mass mining will eventually make the game inaccessible for new players.  Both because they will not be able to compete in gathering resources and also because mass mining will lead to too much of a resource advantage for existing players.

 

Personally, I hope some resources can be mass mined to an extent; for example, minerals used to build buildings or the basic structure of space stations.  I don't think mass mining these resources will necessarily ruin gameplay and we will need a lot these resources if we are going to build the cities and structures the developers want us to build.

 

Ultimately, the replay value comes from the emergent gameplay.  It will be up to us to make the game continually interesting.

Did i ever say mass mining or making Flying more complycatet i meant that it will need more then 1 Pilot in complycatet ship wath will improfe the mutlyplayer game play

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Automatic or large mining won't happen since the devs believe that will kill the mining gameplay for new players. Any increase in mining efficiency will likely occur with skills or nanoformer upgrades and even then it won't be much better than default.

 

Piloting a ship shouldn't be difficult if built correctly. Building it correctly could be difficult depending on circumstances.

 

Everything mentioned about player interaction is going to be left up to the players entirely. One of the great things about DU will be the emergent gameplay.

Yes massMining im not speaking from mass mining im speaking from just from automatet mining that dont flood the server with Ores

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Yes massMining im not speaking from mass mining im speaking from just from automatet mining that dont flood the server with Ores

 

Automatic mining of any sort will flood the market with whatever is being mined. Not sure why you could possibly think otherwise. It's already been said multiple times in this thread, the devs have plainly said there won't be any sort of ships that can mine or automatic mining, specifically for this reason. Please find something else to suggest, as this topic is already done.

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Its should not be Hard to Fly you simply should have more stuff that you have to Controll so it could be usfull that have an other pilot controlling the Ships system of Overheat and DMG  especially in fights so thats there is a dude looking for evry system and then he sees like oh well we have dmg on cabel to of the Rightside of the ship we have to powerdown some systems or the cable will melt, and send somone to go there and look waths where the DMG is he may could Fix it!

 

  

 

There will of course be engineers paying close attention to the stresses on the engine and various weapons. Any battleship will be just as complex as real life ones.

 

This doesn't proclude us from having complicated and difficult piloting. The skill required to be a pilot should be like in Tie Fighter - lots of stuff to remember, but realistically learnable. Piloting skill points shouldn't really make you that much better a fighter, it should be about actual skill.

 

Most games simulate improvement. In Skyrim, what's the difference between someone who's never touched a sword in their life and a master swordsman? Their one-handed skill level and the skills from that branch that they've chosen. The actual gameplay is identical - use the left mouse button for an attack, and hold it for a power attack. This incredibly simplistic combat system makes it boring outside of random chance occurences such as beheadings, sneak attacks, kill cams, or archer sniping. These don't require that the player actually understand the system any better, because it's so simple that you already understand it before purchasing the game.

 

DU should be about taking that simulated improvement and throwing it in the garbage. The game's not simulating a well-run political system, or a poorly commanded ship, why should this change for flying? Picking up a small fighter and getting it to move, sure, that should be easy. Being an ace? Not at all. Flying a battleship? Should be a very difficult job involving collaboration between a very skilled pilot and navigator to successful work in a battle.

 

I want to be able to have a game where if someone's just joined, but they're a really good pilot, that my organisation really wants this guy. Sure, the experienced pilot may be able to 'naturally' (due to skill points) reduce G-forces, or get a bit more out of an engine, and the programmed LUA moves may be satisfactory in battle, but this guy's so good that we could put him on an old ship that's completely manual and would still kick our enemy's asses.

 

Ok that nice i would love to go in a Cave to the Core of the Planet and i have no problem with this game mechanic if i dont have to do it and if there are people how want to do it :D

Planet cores are enormous. You can only dig 2km down before it becomes too hot for you or your machinery to function (in reality, it's where the voxels stop).

 

Automated mining would crash the economy multiple times and only cause strife and grief. It isn't fun for new players to find that their simple mining is easily outclassed by people who have been playing the game for years and have a ship that can strip mine a planet in a matter of weeks. This goes against literally everything NQ are trying to do with this game so it doesn't became like EVE or WoW where after a certain number of years the people who have been playing for so long are just so much more obviously better that new players don't want to join and it bleeds subscribers. I'm one of those people by the way - ever since I started hearing about EVE stories in 2012 I've wanted to join the game, but it always seemed like there was a large barrier to entry (and a highschooler would have struggled with the sub payment) so I never bothered.

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Planet cores are enormous. You can only dig 2km down before it becomes too hot for you or your machinery to function (in reality, it's where the voxels stop).

 

 

 

Does the Foxels stop in just 2 KM?

From wehre do you have this Information?

I thougt it would be Like in SpaceEngineers where you can Make a Hole true the complete Planet(somting like 130Km R or D im accualy not sure but im Thinking D) ^^

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Planet cores are enormous. You can only dig 2km down before it becomes too hot for you or your machinery to function (in reality, it's where the voxels stop).

 

 

 

Does the Foxels stop in just 2 KM?

From wehre do you have this Information?

I thougt it would be Like in SpaceEngineers where you can Make a Hole true the complete Planet(somting like 130Km R or D im accualy not sure but im Thinking D) ^^

The entire planet is made out of voxels.

You can only dig 2km deep currently is because of gameplay reasons.

 

It was said that on certain moons it might be possible to dig from one end to the other.

 

No source because it was said in a youtube interview. I did advice you to catch up on available information. ;)

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