Commander_Kapow

+1 Honestly at this point the only thing stopping me to get completely 100% behind this game is the threat of Tab targeting. As a person who loves sims I just can't get behind such basic MMO combat style based on stats and spread sheets rather then skill...

My main fear is that Tab Targeting in combination with Scripting will simply mean that victory falls to those who have better scripted guns/targeting instead of skill. I would love to read a Devblog addressing the issue of targeting and combat on it's own. It would be really interesting to know what NC plans for us

It is a pity that Tab targeting will be the main method (at least from my understanding of all devblogs and what I've gathered thus far. Personally I would have much more preferred options such as soft targeting or arc fire which would draw a little bit more but shouldn't kill the networking as badly as physically based targeting - https://board.dualthegame.com/index.php?/topic/621-firing-arcs/ The main issue I see here is that while the game offers more then EVE in terms of building, exploration and player community, it is shaping up to be very similar to eve in the fighting department and that would mean a fight of macros instead of a fight of skill. I hope I'm wrong, but Tab Targeting in space offers less skill based combat in my opinion then for Example the more modern MMORPG where you have at least dodge and block mechanics ect on top of Tab Targeting making the fight at least that bit more entertaining (I still don't class any tab targeting MMORPG Fight system as fun or overly skill based. I've played GW2 for a while and once my Necromancer build was done I could defeat almost any monster (excluding dungeons) with simple press 1,3,4,6 dodge here and there and rinse and repeat...). Tab Targeting also decreases any need for multicrew at least I can't see where multicrew comes to play in terms of combat when the fight is tab targeting.

I think that Death Need to be punishing. If that means loosing a lot when the player dies thanks to your items being scavenged before you get back to the place of death..... I think that this is the best way to go. This should in theory decrease the amount of senseless killing in some ways and support proper piracy.

I prefer the idea of Free for All as much as possible. While it does make it more dangerous if the rewards match the risk I'm ok with it. More artificial limits/rules that are put in the game might be off putting to newcomers who will have to learn /grasp these rules as well as some of these rules could be immersion breaking which would be a pity.

In my opinion the best system is with 0 RNG , but I also understand the fact that the team has 25 people and creating possible event trees for 100s of possible scenarios might be impossible. I'm a software dev myself and our product is purely event based to help professionals in our field of expertise and in our subject of that field in their work (for comparison lets say we would only specialize in mining one type of mineral to compare the scale between what we make and what DU is trying to make), but just the field we work in I and my team spent over a year developing all the possible event trees to make sure that 99% of the possibilities are catered for. Hence the fact that I understand that some elements of RNG will probably be required. It just about how much .....

I agree that 1000s of ships in one small space would be a kill for real time targeting, but on the other hand we could have some sort of soft targeting - general area (ie the ship's hit radius is larger then the object itself) with some assumption system like in ESO could allow for large battles but with real time targeting. Not an easy task but should be possible now.

To be honest if Tab targeting is part of the game it would be very disappointing for PVP. it would lead to simple stats crunching and skill will get slightly buried under who has the best macros which I would not really enjoy (Only my personal opinion of course). My most played Game is Elite Dangerous - which obviously is a different cattle of fish to Dual Universe and one of the biggest pitfalls of ED is their networking system (caugh p2p caugh....) but with today's technolgy we should be able to achieve much better combat then tab targeting. As long as the Targeting is skill based - Controlling a turret manually/AI or facing your dog fighting ship for half as described above for a second to get a lock and fire ect, or using arcs.... then it would be ok or soft targeting (rather similar to arcs) in a style of Elder Scrolls Online allowing for more latency as the aiming in general vicinity with pro calculated delay leads to hit or miss result while using a assumption system to give result to players to give the illusion of Real Time..... Not exactly ED dogfighting with real physics, but skill would be still required and thus I would still find it very satisfying to PVP or risk going out to mine into an are where I might get attacked (although I would clearly have to shelf my Hotas for this one ). Side note - I'm not a PVP player, but I like it when If I have to engage in PVP it will be skill that decides on my life rather then Macros/stats.

RNG (Random Number Generators) is a great tool when not overused. It is something which is very easy thing to slide into a game, especially one which uses Procedural elements extensively. However it is also a trap for player leading often to disappointment as the risk vs reward is often left to the RNG element rather then player skill. Striking the balance between RNG and Player Skill is very difficult, but there is another option to add to the development and that is event based rules. # Examples are completely made up just to explain what I'm bumbling on above. Examples - RNG - Mining for Special mineral - You fly to an asteroid field and start mining (or scanning) - Regardless how the asteroid looks an RNG will determine what you get from the Asteroid- This turns gameplay into brain numming grind which disrespect gamers time Skill Based - The asteroids have Visual element which helps the player to find the right asteroid and there could be unique way of mining to deliver the best results - materials. While still RNG deciding what materials are in the Asteroid before you even see it, this way it requires the player to use their skill to mine, thus making it feel more rewarding Event Based - The skill based level applies, but the best asteroids can be found in areas with certain conditions / events that occured or can be diagnosed through knowledge in the game leading the player into that area in the first place. This added level of rules increases the immersion as player just doesn't fly blindly from asteroid field to asteroid field but looks for an event that could have caused the asteroids to be rich in minerals... Even a Rumor could be a good lead.. Events can drive further systems - Pirating, Bounty Hunting, Corporate espionage ect... All of these are much better when they are event driven then just RNG, so I pitch the idea to avoid too much RNG for the love of the players as this project holds a lot a lot of promise At the end we still get the same materials - but the way we get them is either more or less rewarding and that is why RNG should be very limited in use in the game, but rather a rule/event based system should be in place which allows for more predictability, but requiring more skill..

Devblogs and devblogs I've been having a read myself and it is a wealth of information on how this game is conceptualized. To be honest there isn't really an MMO like this one out there from what I've read in the blogs (EvE is the closed inspiration in the words of the Devs). They are definitely the best call at this point

I think that pay to play is perfectly fine as long as people can earn the ingame time by playing the game. I for one don't have us much free time as some, so I will be paying my monthly sub if and when that becomes applicable, but on the other hand I like that those who have time, but not that much money can join in and play with me. Buy to play doesn't give enough money to the Server based games unless they load the cash shop and in that case we are reaching the free to play domain which I genuinely dislike as it leads to underfunded games and terrible cash shop politics.

Well for one I'm on here thanks to E3. I've never heard of this game until the Trailer, but I was literally breathless after the trailer. I really hope that this game gets the support it deserves as this is finally a player driven game concept I can back without a bit of hesitation. The player driven world, PVP as well as building together can make for some of the most amazing unforgettable gaming experience in the last decade, so I'm all in

I'm wondering how far does DU plan to go in terms of flying simulation. Will we be able to use Hotas with this game and benefit from the features or do you plan to make it purely Keyboard/mouse game. Also Congrats on the Trailer. If you simply deliver what you have in your list now I will subscribe in one single breath. The idea of Eve like multiplayer with building, constructing, scripting, PVP and real time combat is breath taking. My only hope is that the flying/fighting doesn't become tab targeting, but will be more "sim" based. I'll be sure to keep my eye and I wonder what the rest of you think? How far should the flight simulation go? Would you want to use Hotas or benefit from using it? Would you prefer the flight model to be more arcade like and use Xbox Controller / mouse/ keyboard? I love simulators like Elite Dangerous, but I also love building games and player driven MMO model, so I wonder if this will be the ultimate dream game for my wants and desires

I would love to add the voice of support for VR. Personally I'm a Vive owner and playing something like this with Vive controller would be absolutely amazing.