Zamarus

Honestly not getting your last message here. But either way i think NQs plan for just having the arkship zone being a safezone is good as it is. People won't be geared for combat for a while and even when they are the world is big enough that it's unlikely you will get attacked any often outside the safezone even. If you want to NEVER be attacked stay inside the safezone or build in hidden locations

Actually i don't think that is necessary. You must realize also that people won't exactly start with a fleet and an Arsenal of weapons. Peoples capabilities for combat will be pretty low because players have to get weapons themselves

What you view as balanced is probably not what i view as balanced. You did even give examples of what kind of "balance" you wanted. Of course im taking that as you wanting the expense of PvP to suit you, don't hide it under the term "balanced" because that is to a large extent subjective.

I don't see how that is a misrepresentation, you literally advocated for expensive PvPing, that NQ should balance it so that killing people would yield little.

The implication was people were bringing up pointless or invalid concerns

Good, then i see where you stand excuse me. Because i recalled you arguing the same as Felonou, if not i apologize. What they argued was for offensive PvP to be costly and/or yield little. Which i thought was absurd, if you understand the safezone and potential future safezones i think we agree for the most part.

Alright, because that's not the picture i get from earlier in the discussion. Building and PvP will happen all around us unhindered, are you okay with that? Just checking here.

I honestly dont know how you can say that about building and not PvP, both are available to do whatever with, neither is crammed down your throat.

Taking shit like this out of context is why we have all these care-bear concerns on the forums. I've argued plenty already so i will be a bit brash but listen to their videos from the kickstarter ffs.

You don't usually call mmo's pvp mmo's, just look at all of them pvp is factored in the term "mmo" per automation. Because in game development you test destruction before construction? No of course building is tested first, even in a full fledged PvP-prio game they would do it in that order, not saying DU will prioritize that but its absurd to think that its an indicator. You'll start with one protection bouble, the arkship safezone, they've been talking about discovering others but that is something you cant rely on for a long time. Build your own shields, fortresses and so on, a player driven sandbox doesnt need to have safezones everywhere, in fact if players are meant to build civilizations what you former thought was a need for devs to provide for you a large org might be strong enough to have a secure large open city you can use the same way. Isn't that cool to think of? "Not talking about fact but it was an obvious prediction" If that's what you are saying i disagree with the latter and it still sounded like the former.

Then please explain how your statement of "Primary Dual Universe is primarily a building game due to voxel space. We can tag this "SANDBOX" Secondary Dual Universe is secondarily an interaction game due to freedom of player interactions possible: Trade, Combat, Politics. We can tag this "SIMULATION"" Doesn't warrant my responses. Because i most definitely think your statement is false. And remember that when writing something like this without mentioning that its your opinion you WILL be taken for trying to state facts.

No, i'm basing it on what NQ has said about a player driven world and how that would play out. I don't think I've said it enough times i guess but i never claimed nor did anyone claim that PvP is all of it. Let me run that back to my previous answer. The sum of it being that all the parts work together from the player using their own brain not relying on the devs holding your hand.

I think you might want to sharpen your understanding of Player Driven, of course a game is designed as a whole, but they are focusing on providing the tools and not designing HOW people should use them in the end. Fill me in, i didn't see anyone in this discussion demanding realism.

If you don't want to argue anymore then stop replying, meant honest, not derogatory way. I did not see this math and i do not think its a good idea at all. But what you are right on is that people have plenty to make up their mind. You never said more than "make it expensive to attack people" which i won't take as anything else than wanting to regulate PvP. I mean what is the point of saying so otherwise. It's quite obvious what sandbox and player-driven entails imo.

Not really, what i've been arguing and some others is for the option of not doing anything. Not interfering with the sandbox we are given, it's at this point pro-change vs no need Edit: Or let me rephrase myself better. "Pro regulated vs unregulated PvP"

"I already supplied a solution. It simply has to be worth more to leave most people alone than it is to attack them in standard point and shoot circumstance. This doesn't take anything away from you PvPers except you would have to make a cost benefit analysis before ganking that newbie." This would most certainly do that. Because doing this wont just help defenseless people but be abused by everyone. Also how have you planned on making the resources gained difference between defenseless and non-defenseless people here? I don't see how you make the game do that without magic, because all solutions would force you to mess with more game mechanics than you originally were thinking about.

Hey, you realize who is advocating for less freedom here? It does make it less player driven if you actively try to cripple PvP in favour of Building

Because construction and destruction is not a linear relationship, better players will destroy worse players faster even if both have two juggernauts for ships. They want to make a PLAYER DRIVEN sandbox. This means players deal with player-made problems, the tools are there for builders, PvPers and all therein, its up to you how to utilize them. You realize that taking away the "just deal with it" aspect would make it less player driven thus not what they have been talking about and theres tons of players that doesnt want to see that happen, you are not ever gonna truly reach "all of us".

I think that fear is irrational. Seeing as with the vast space provided with the travel distances, cover to hide and be protected by environment you're not very likely to be attacked very often as any individual located somewhere outside the safezone in the universe

When people discover them on remote planets in the distant future or so

Just because PvP is enabled in 99% of the world does not mean PvP will occur on every single cubic meter outside the safezone, people are worrying too much

I already have accepted that. And it's called the arkship safezone, nothing else

Actually no. I'm not downplaying building at all, i'm saying that all major features both building and PvP isn't above one and another at all and players will have to solve every situation in the game with their own brain. What has been advocated is for PvP to be secondary to building and with that ways of protecting the building element from the evils of PvP. Vastly different

Cool stuff man. So if 1832 years is required for 1000 people. Then it means it would require one million players to do it in 1.8 years? That's pretty huge

What you did here is assume building is the absolute feature and trumps combat in every way by saying "the secondary should never engulf the primary" This is completely subjective to your own desires. Theres multiple equally important major features, building and PvP are definitely two major features, you are disregarding this by categorising major features as secondary like combat and trade to your personal favourite element that is Building in this case. This mindset is something that will lead you to complain about PvP as soon as you feel it hinders you from doing your Building in peace. Ponder this: How about people stop demanding to be sheltered and learn how to build while coping with the threat of PvP? Like in a lot of examples from before, make sure you dont chose a dumb ass location to build on, hire protection/hide it if you need to. Even then in the expansive world that is DU chances are nobody will attack you for a long while because of how vast everything is and how long time it may take to gain power enough to cause major damage.