Posts posted by Shulace
14 hours ago, GraXXoR said:
Not sure what Gloria Estefan has to do with it...
but it’s likely that we are feeling their servers starting to strain under untenable load from all the digging that people have done.
that is why finally... after years of people explaining to NQ the flawed nature of their ridiculously pointless-and-redundant planetary voxel persistence model (or alternatively: stupidly believing that NQ had really HAD invented some never-before-seen data storage and retrieval methods) their 100% verbose dig record-keeping has come back to bite them in the arse.
it might also be likely that they just can’t afford the bandwidth/processing capacity any longer given they are down to just a dozen or so still-paying customers, ? and have turned down the auto spool-up rate/ max number limit on their virtual servers.
I guess he's trying to say people are addicted for whatever reason to DU.
A reason why they can't just fill up all those holes is because some people built bases in them, imagine if one of their 30 remaining subscribers lost their underground home they spent days digging out. They can't afford to lose any more players lel.
Most of us called all this tone deafness out the moment they started mentioning what they were planning in 0.23. It was what, like a few weeks before the actual patch itself?
When they actually went ahead and delivered all the things that weren't wanted AND more in that patch I knew where this game was headed.
Some folks laughed and dismissed our voices back then, now we're all laughing at this trainwreck.
I still stand by my F2P or shutdown statement. I really can't see a viable comeback like this after all this time.
44 minutes ago, Haku0814 said:
Why not just have static planetary cores have no ceiling aside from planetwide build height O_o
-Several less entries in DB for server ( if its setup the way im thinking )
-Would require adjusting the render distance to accommodate for the height or depth of static on planets
People don't like space elevator towers apparently. Because that's what they are going to build with that. I personally would like to see the planet look like a sea urchin, would mean the players actually made a mark in the verse lol.
Can't revive the game, dead posts gonna have to suffice.
ayo, mfukin shark coming through, pack your shit up and go back to and SC keep dreaming about server meshing.
3 hours ago, FryingDoom said:
Such a shame CCP caved in to the Null Sec cry babies. So many people who had not played for years were starting to come back. CCP should have taken the risk and the game would have so many more people now.
The truth is; the wallet speaks orders of volumes over how hard you can cry over the forums.
You see that fact then with CCP and now with Novaquark.
The only difference is that Eve had the population and experience to be able to take a financial hit like that, Dual Universe does not.
1 hour ago, Cheith said:
Now that is quibbling - there is no traditional instancing in the game where you can have different views of the 'universe' depending on what shard you are on. An instance in of itself implies that there are multiple copies of a single 'template' (much as in object oriented programming) each with their own distinct data. If we have to quibble on details.
So, technically, EVE does not have instancing. EVE has multiple servers sharing a single very custom RDBMS - not the same thing at all. From what I remember an EVE server hosted a variable number of solar systems depending on their expected population. One of the reasons why the GMs typically wanted to know where large battles were going to occur so that they could pre-set those particular systems up.
Yup, they also have a soft limit of around 6400 players per system, after that you can't really get in. All sorts of things start to break and it is soul crushing to fight in the ensuing time dilation. I enjoy dropping capitals in those fights but after sitting 12 hours of waiting just to jump, I was done. 1 cycle of a 10 second gun takes over 10 minutes in fights like that.
In premise, its amazing, in reality its just so bad. That is what happens when you let alliances grow to sizes where just 1 side of a conflict has enough players waiting that can soft cap a whole system and break it.
Then CCP PR department cums in their pants and spreads it all over the news about how record breaking the fight was when it was really absolute dogshit to be a part of even though a lot of supers were lost due to server melting as in the case of M2-XFE.
4 minutes ago, SirJohn85 said:
1. It was advertised during the KS Campaign in 2016 that it will have a 20km SZ and everything else is PvP
2. There was a pvp Trailer in June 2020 that literally advertised the pvp part.
Sources with timestamp:
Sure, what did they eventually release to subscription? Those combat adverts were also deceiving.
The point is the game in the adverts is not what was sold as subs, you kickstarter folks got shafted. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to blame pve players for the state of the game.
3 hours ago, blazemonger said:
And here is where I do not agree. PVE content in a game like DU should be designed to carry enough reward to be worth the risk of engaging with the content while at the same time, it provides enough of a challenge and opportunity for PVP players to engage the PVE players in those situations. That is how these mechanics IMO should be balanced. As a PVE player you know you can and will encounter PVP and will lose ships but overall the rewards are worth the risk or the loss.
If you want to not be bothered, stay in the safe zone, choose a single player game or a game with a PVE only mode to play, not a game which is clearly and openly advertised as a game with PVP components you may encounter any time you step outside of a safe zone.
You done lost your mind.
If Dual Universe was advertised as a PvP intensive game when they started selling subscriptions, no one would be here(I certainly wouldn't be here) and as I asked before; where in the tutorial did you learn about PvP to claim this is a first and foremost a PvP game?
I am not asking you how the game should be, I am asking you what the game is and ever was ever since it starting charging people subscriptions. This is actually a GIANT mining/building/crafter game with some trading.
People that streamed this game were streaming about building when I started playing, I never even knew PvP existed until I saw a weapon in the assembly crafting list myself. I didn't even know what PvP looked like until I finished my fighter ship and realized you can't shoot guns in atmosphere, I had to Youtube what combat looked like and decided it was actual ass and not worth the time. I legit thought I was looking at the wrong game when I first saw what combat looked like, thinking to myself; "DU is so groundbreaking, this can't be what the combat is right?". Nothing is appealing for the combat, I guess this is why NQ focused on PvE content mostly thus far.
You are blaming players for how Novaquark made their game, absolutely absurd.
8 minutes ago, le_souriceau said:
^ This. Its even very easy to trace with objective evidence of NQs (JCs) blablabla if you dig in old stuff.
Initialy DU was promised as very PvP-centered game (it was main/only reason why some people particiapated in KS). Then its U-turned to some lame Landmark-2 with elements of PvP (and even then most of them heavly downgraded in importance and postponed to somewhere in future).
Lol that is unfortunate, money man, all back to the money. They know no one wants to pay sub for a PvP intensive game.
People make me chuckle when they argue that this game is meant to be a PvP game first and foremost.
I have to ask, when you were a fresh player starting, when were you ever taught about PvP?
Remember that starting area? What did they teach you in the shoddy tutorials? Yes, that is correct, building, flying and not much else lol.
This game can't and will never be Eve, people have wars in that game because of drama, power tripping and has robust social/org/alliance tools that enable them to do so.
PvP is fun in Eve, in which only a SMALL part of the overall population PvP because their industry/NPC missions is fleshed out. PvP is a web browser game in DU. PvP is also not the only factor driving the economy in Eve, a nice chunk is some bozo over reaching in an high level NPC mission and getting sploded, I had my days lol.
Wars are the major economy shifters, but for that you'd have to become Eve like in scale, which ain't happening anytime soon, if DU survives maybe in 5-10 years given they figure out how to manage the spaghetti and are able to grow the pop to Eve levels(unlikely).
If in your mind the game has to be about PvP to be successful, then you missed the point entirely.
Either the devs made the wrong game, or you're playing the wrong game.
Well you lasted 5 months longer than the rest of us lol.
Now the forums will be a ghost town if no one is propping up the post per day.
When it comes to Dual Universe markets I see a lot of people complaining about the market bots. I can tell that the players against it are looking out for their personal best interest and not caring about how it will effect the failing game economy as a whole. The players for it have no other way to make quanta, in fact there is no other way to inject viable amounts of quanta into the game as far as I am aware.
Once upon a time for industry/builder folks like myself, mining was a means to an end. Mining was the only reasonable way I could have a ship part that did not take me 2 months of mining and selling ore to afford. It was the most cost effective/efficient way to do things if I could put in the time and effort to push out all the parts to get the end result. Even so there were MANY players that just simply preferred to just sell the ore to the bots as it was easier for them on the brain.
Now imagine as it stands, NQ removes the market bots from the game. What do you think will happen to ore prices?
The ore prices will start to floor. This is good for the folks with lots of quanta who do not want to mine for their industry/org and on the other hand VERY bad for the new players that just want quanta to buy a prebuilt ship...so they can mine more, crash it due to one of the many bugs....then uninstall, but I digress. The point is, the market bots are one of the many band-aids for the game.
Remember the 0.23 removal of the logout failsafe, fetch removal? Those were band-aids as well and it caused massive harm to the playerbase when they were removed because it was imposed without fixing the underlying problems the band-aids were used to protect players from, instead they upscaled the problem by introducing module destruction(still a headscratcher), then having to roll back after the playerbase exodus.
Post 0.23 world, I am not sure there are that many players left to supply a low price ore market. There is not enough demand for ore to push it past what the market bots were paying anyways, I do not believe there is ore consumption comparable to pre 0.23 anymore as the schematics effectively limited the demand.
Not many people enjoy mining for quanta, it is tedious and boring. Also there is the option to place your buy order higher than the bot orders if you feel strongly on the matter, highest bidder always get the product the fastest, everyone will sell to you. For me personally ore was worth more than any of the bot prices listed because it was so tedious to obtain and haul.
Now don't get me wrong, there are viable issues with the market bots method of currency injection, you are trading a finite resource for an unlimited supply of currency. At the same time there are issues with the currency itself. You have to think about what the currency is ultimately used for. How much demand is there for whatever the currency is supposed to buy? If you rely on the current economic model, that the currency is meant to mostly be traded between players, then you will eventually have more currency than ore in the universe, as it is recycled from player to player for the most part.
There are very few quanta sinks, element destruction cannot hope to offset/stimulate the economy on its own, I see people bring this point up often but even in a bug free flying environment it won't work that well. There are simply not enough players as well as not enough different quanta injectors/sinks to drive a macro economy, you need more variation. Ore should have never been used as the primary way to inject quanta into the game as it is finite and is the base for all industry, which generate what the players will use quanta to purchase anyways. In effect you're trading one currency for a less valuable form.
Tiles, blueprint copying, default market ships are not good enough sinks. Cosmetics for quanta could be one part, but there needs to be more. Schematics, sure another small part, but this was more of a black hole for the economy than an economy balancing sink, with how it was implemented it harmed the playerbase far more than it fixed the economy, basically forcefully reduced the value of ore as a commodity/currency while effectively deleting player progress/work. At first glance it probably looked like the holy grail to NQ and smooth brains alike. A pseudo economy reset for sure but pointless in the long run when it caused so much harm to the playerbase and effectively addressed none of the underlying problems.
TLDR: Market bots are just another band-aid, not good but remove it and you will harm your playerbase further lacking another viable quanta faucet.
1 hour ago, Eternal said:
not to be racist or anything
I won a Erebus Titan on hypernet.
Sold it to buy a Hel and a few Naglafars, then a couple months later the current unending war broke out, fought for as long as I could, killed quite a few caps and supercaps, before getting burnt out from blue balls and overhyped fleets. When the fights do happen, its a miserable experience with the time dilations.
Asset safety over 30 bil in shit and letting the account sit till the game gets fun again in a few years maybe.
All the hopes dreams and passion of the 20 or so current paying subscribers won't save DU.
At the end of the day its all about money, which has been a part of pretty much every factor why we are here now.
There's no game in the game. Thus no hope. The developers, or rather, influential players/backers with a lot of money pushed an agenda to make the game "civilization based", even if it meant sucking the life out of it.
DU was at least a platform for creators to build and fly their creations in an MMO setting. This was actually the only platform that can do that reasonably pre 0.23 patch as far as I am aware currently. Now not so much unless you take it up as a job and mine for the big corps.
It was fun though, Pre patch 0.23 you'd have gotten your 20 dollars worth. Unless you're a masochist that do not like ANY OTHER GENRE than MMO space simulation this "game" is not worth your time.
Probably best to wait and check out Starbase once that goes open beta/early access.
This forum is entertaining(more so than the game), and its free so there's that
1 hour ago, joaocordeiro said:
Yea, I agree with you.
But can't we blame this in their "programmer/engineer mindset"?
Because, the lack of professionals in areas outside of coding, thinking they can do it all,
the lack of tools to gather proper feedback,
the importance of a selected group of players, while disregarding others,
the general stubbornness regarding all this,
is usually associated with that narrow "programmer/engineer mindset".
That's the thing though, they did reach out and did official surveys for feedback, like a lot of folks took part. There was good feedback, even their polls showed what the playerbase wanted....and they ignored it all lol.
I just don't think its right to just blame it on a mindset, that sounds tame compared to what was done to this project. My point is, all this flack is kind of self inflicted and warranted lol.
24 minutes ago, joaocordeiro said:
I agree with you, but, some of the players complained about the lack of depth into industry and industry talents.
Saying that everyone could do everything without any commitment.
This is a reaction to that complaining.
The result is bad, but we can say they "shit" on the playerbase when it was a result of hearing to it.
Now, when you're in charge of a project, you have to be able to judge good advice from bad ones. Know your playerbase, taking advice from 12 or so people to change the whole game is a bit much. Its only those folks remaining; the "playerbase" that asked for this if you will. It boggles the mind.
Can you compare the games' subreddit activity falloff since 0.23? It's amazing really. I would honestly be shocked if there was more than 200 people still playing this game on a daily, that number is probably on the high end too.
Edit: The real reason they made the changes was that they underestimated player progression and wanted to make the game grindier to extend player subs/retention(they can't create meaningful content that works fast enough). I almost feel embarrassed saying that, everything else is just secondary, as ridiculous as it is, its true.
44 minutes ago, joaocordeiro said:
I dont think this is intended.
Just a side effect from the overload of work.
The problem is that "overload of work" went precisely into boning the playerbase, even though the community complained beforehand and they did it anyways. The sheer amount of changes in 0.23 was ALOT of WORK, you actually have to try to mess up that bad and they did lol. So much potential down the drain.
Honestly, NQ shit on their playerbase so hard that its not unprofessional to call them out like that. All the better if they are aware of how things go when you mismanage your game, chances are better for Starbase to succeed if they are paying attention.
3 hours ago, SirJohn85 said:
As I am in the Starbase Closed Alpha since mid 2020 and have no NDA and am allowed to show and talk everything:
There is currently only one gas planet and if I am not mistaken 10 moons. The closest being around 20'000km (55 hours at 100 m/s , 37 hours at 150m/s) from the asteroid belt. The largest moon is thought to be 1000km in diameter. Planned features: player built stations (on moon and space, space is already in the making), mining lunar rocks. More to come with time, I guess.
You won't be able to have a voxel-like comparison with DU because Starbase has no voxels. Think of it more like a kit that follows the principle of Space Engineers and Empyrion, but has a comparably great complexity of DU. I think everyone has to decide for themselves what they find more beautiful. I think both approaches are good.
The other things, however, sound more exciting to me:
- Modifiable engines that you have to cool? It's in.
- Modifiable command seats with buttons, displays, server racks, a programming language and saving code on elements and giving it to other players? Yes, it's there.
- Modifiable weapon attachments for the mounted weapons on the ships? Yep.
- Cable and pipe management for power and fuel? Sure, you'll need to build a redundant system inside the ship.
- Glass elements? Mhm, yep.
- AvA, CvC, raiding ships? Yes!
- Can I place mining lasers on the ship? Yessss!
- Can I carry the asteroids with my ship to a safe zone and mine them there in peace? YES!
- Ship designer? Yep.
Thanks for this, I was lookin for some solid info about this game for a little while.
DU needs to take the first step and become a game before you can talk about taking ideas from other games, as is, DU has nothing game loop wise, its all just an attempt at simulation. NQ just wants to sit back and let their community do all the work for content creation because for some reason or the other, be it incompetence or lack of funding, they are unable to to create meaningful features for the project that could turn it into a game to retain players.
NQ-Deckard response to "negotiation" attempts in DUscord
in General Discussions
? Juicy stuff, I'm glad I check up on the forums once in a while for entertaining gems like these.
Also there's seems to be people who publicly quit this game that still play ?
The game has been going well over the past year I see, looking forward to the forums throughout this year and taking bets if it will last the whole year lol.